Knock out

[griogal]

random is a AD&D kind of way...
random within a range...
a range that improves with skill...
and at any level a 5% chance for hurting yourself and a 5% chance of hitting even the normally unstoppable.

I think this would be a fair system. The tricky point is however, how do you improve?

[Solfius]

the range is more in your favour the better you get

[Meh]

This is going to be a bit complex.

Make the weapons half a effective as today on average.

If you spend an hour training you go up 2% on average. Each day you reduce 1% until your back at the base. This is sepcific per weapon. The upper limit would be to have the weapon twice as effective as it is today. It would take 100 days or 5 Cantr years to reach the top.

For each LETHAL combat your in you gain 10% but only against the weapon and sheild combination you fought against and only with the weapon and shield combination you fought with. An additional boost of 1% limited to one a day for general fighting. Both of these combat learning bonuses are limited to once a day per combination.

This prevents people sparing each other to god status. Also there would be a difference between hacking unarmed civilians and going up against an armed opponent. Unique weapon and shield combinations may come into fashion. You may be good against a carrot gathering peasant but what out for those wheat farmers. They have sickles and your not used to that.

[Solfius]

does that mean that attacking a person with a shield and weapon will boost your stats by 10%?

[rklenseth]

But what you are talking about is just as much AD&D as the randomness. I think Jos said he wanted to stay away from all of that.

I think a combat system should be programmed where the player doesn't know how it works and is very complicated. That means a player doesn't know how to get to the ulitimate warrior character unless he/she happens to do the right things. I think there should be randomness like the way gathering and farming for resources work today. Also, there should be some sort of stamina system so that one character with an iron shield and a crossbow can be taken out by 5 men with wooden shields and hunting bows. That will make numbers factor into it. Also allow for someone to miss from time to time and change one attack a day to one attack per turn but drastically lower the steel weapons damage and the same with iron shields. But also allow for the possiblility that a mortal blow could hit where the person is killed instantly or dies at a certain rate. For example someone is hit in the head would most likely die instantly or very quickly. Another example would be is someone is stabbed in the torso area but doesn't die quickly instead they die slowly over time. I would also like to see wounds and such added to the game where someone is hit by a certain weapon and a certain wound would be given to the character. Now that person will have to dress the wound or slowly bleed to death but not in all cases. Even if the wound is dressed it has to heal and the character could get infections and other nasty stuff. After the wound heals a scar could be added to someone's description.

[ephiroll]

I was just thinking, there is one thing that would be easy to do and would bring the weapons and shields into better balance...just lower the protection of all the shields by 5, a quick fix until a better combat system could be worked out.

[thingnumber2]

If it were one attack per turn instead of per day, people who are online more, would have the advantage over people like me who only get on a few times a day....[/quote]

[rklenseth]

Not if the combat system was reformed. Currently it would make it unfair. I say lower steel weapons and iron shields. Then add in the randomness and combat skill system as well as add in stamina and wounds like I suggested. Stamina is the key though. Depending on how tired you are, you will either do very little damage if any or you can't attack at all. This would make it so someone can't attack every turn and will have rest a few turns. Stamina will get higher depending how often you fight or do other physical stuff.

[Meh]

does that mean that attacking a person with a shield and weapon will boost your stats by 10%?

Your stats will improve by 10% if you win lethally but only for the exact shield and weapon combination. You would now be better against an iron shield and crossbow. But change the crossbow to a sabre and keep the iron sheild and your not at good.

[Meh]

If it were one attack per turn instead of per day, people who are online more, would have the advantage over people like me who only get on a few times a day....

I'm for sticking to once a day hits. If you get hit back you can then attack the person who hit you back again instantly. Combat would be quick and dangerous.

[Meh]

Not if the combat system was reformed. Currently it would make it unfair. I say lower steel weapons and iron shields. Then add in the randomness and combat skill system as well as add in stamina and wounds like I suggested. Stamina is the key though. Depending on how tired you are, you will either do very little damage if any or you can't attack at all. This would make it so someone can't attack every turn and will have rest a few turns. Stamina will get higher depending how often you fight or do other physical stuff.

I'm not into the staminia part. A simple health stat is fine for me. But adding stamina wouldn't be the worst change.

Having knock out options and/or drag down options would be good too as you indicated.

[rklenseth]

I think Stamina could become a essential part of Cantr (see my posts about traveling in "hmmmm...."). I think people would have to rest from time to time and even sleep. It would give a use for beds and chairs etc... It would also give numbers with lower quality weapons a chance to take someone down that had an iron shield because eventually he/she would become to tired to block every attack. And every time he/she would attack one of the others, he/she would also get tired so he/she would either have to run away because he/she is outnumber or hope for luck that he/she gets a few good blows in and saves him/herself.

I have been thinking; I think bows and crossbows should be put under a different category as ranged weapons than other weapons and instead of attacking, you can shoot at a certain target; ie. person, animal, target for practice. Perhaps if we are ever able to build battlements, archers from atop can fire down on an enemy without fear of being attacked by a sword from the ground. It could also work from a certain distance but I'm not sure how it would work with the grid system. Also, how about make it prerequisite to have arrows or quarrels in order to shoot. That way one could run out of ammunition. Arrows and quarrels would be made out of wood while there would be different types of arrows heads for different uses and materials. There could be hunting arrowheads (called broadheads today), fishing arrowheads (believe it or not people fish with bows and arrows; I am one of those people), war arrowheads (used for battle), target arrowheads (used for practice or even competition shooting). Then you could make arrowheads out of different materials; steel would be the best while it would still be possible to make it out of iron and possibly bronze if it is ever added to Cantr. Quarrels would be made just from wood and steel and would have only one use; attacking people and animals. Hunting and war tips (another name for an arrowhead) could be used to attack people or animals. Hunting would have a disadvantage in attacking people while war would have none in either case. War tips would do more damage than hunting tips. Once you use either of these types of arrows it is spent and can never be used again. Fishing tips could only be used for fishing and along with making this arrow you would need to make some fishing line to go with it. Bow fishing takes sometime to even get good at nonetheless become a master so one would need to get some practice before he/she reaps any bounty. Fishing arrows can be used again afterwards but may break or get lost over time. Target tips could only be used for one thing and that is shooting at a target for practice or some friendly competition. Arrows here can be used after being retrieved; if you happen to miss the target the arrow becomes lost though. The different material would only really affect hunting and war tips in the damage they do or whether or not they can get a hit in on a person who has a shield or maybe armor someday. So I think the damage a bow does should depend upon what type of bow being used and what type of arrow and what type of material it is made out of. If you're wondering how I know so much about bows and arrows I shoot often as well as I am the Archery Director at the camp I work at over the summer. So I kinda know what I am talking about.

[rklenseth]

And any stats I think should not be seen. You should become aware of whether or not you need rest or not by how well you are doing something or not doing so well. Same goes with strength which I think should be changed to health. You shouldn't know what health you're at but you could get a very good idea by how hurt you are or sick you are. That way you don't always hear people caculating that they need so many mushrooms to get back to full health after they have been through a battle. Instead they can eat the healing foods until they feel they are back to health. I hope the healing foods are eventually taken out and changed with medicines and things like bandages and medical stuff. Many of the healing foods can be made into fruit instead and used in making recipes for certain foods.

[new.vogue.nightmare]

The foods should be used for recovering stamina and speeding up the healing process, but should not directly recover health. That would bemore realistic. I eat foods, and as good as they are for my health, this gaping wound in my side wasn't closing up right away.

[thingnumber2]

Once you use either of these types of arrows it is spent and can never be used again

You should be able to search the body (if it is dead and you actually hit it with arrows) to recover at least some arrows.....and also maybe adrenaline should be added as well, like, it causes you to run faster and attack better and faster and also to carry more, everything...but when it is out it lowers your stamina to the bottom and it takes a long time to recover it again....this would be useful for situations when someone is, outnumbered or attacked....