Don't you just hate it when...(post what you hate)

[Surly]

None of my married characters exchanged rings.

Or rather, he didn't...

[Peter]

I hate it when:

1. I don't know the meaning of an english word
2. I've got to wait for someone to reply
3. I loose a gf
4. your character is looking at someone and the person is writing actions in private. I don't see it as a possibility. Yet I'm guilty at that too. I just realised that a few days.... no one day ago

...

[Missy]

Ah, but rings do have a purpose. They are decorative and a sign of wealth (that you can use resources on these things). They are often given and received as tokens of affection, even among friends.

By the same token, clothes have no purpose, but people like them. In fact, nothing in the clothing/jewelry lists has a purpose, yet people do make them.

In any case, a ring is more likely to be accepted as a nice, extravagent gift, than, say, a trowel, even though the trowel takes resources as well.

Out of the however many items there are to manufacture, all marriages I have seen use rings for marriage.
Are you seriously arguing that it is not due to OOC influence?

My Siomian wedding didn't include rings. My other wedding only included one ring if I remember correctly.

And we call it a wedding because it's the most appropriate term. Union, sounds like something MORE from the real world than the word wedding does, to me. Besides, wedding while has a dictionary meaning, surely, means something different to characters, I think. For one set of my own, it meant forever. For another set it meant nothing changed, but now they were acknowledged as an entity, mostly.

We could call it a party, and still people would complain of it being ripped from the real world.

The point is, how do you describe those things above, one wordedly without saying "we're married!" I'd much rather say "we're married" than have to say "We made a vow to be toghether forever." Everytime someone asks about their function as a couple. Marriage is about the only word I can think of that describes what has really taken place. Wedding is iffy, could be exchanged with the word Union or Vow or well...you name it.

I just don't see a problem with those words, really.

[mortaine]

Who cares if it's due to OOC influence, Nick? Out of however many ways you can express pleasure, people still choose to grin, smile, or laugh-- is that due to OOC influence?

You cannot escape some influence from the outside world, because we must use outside language, and with language comes ideas.

I haven't witnesses any weddings in Cantr, so I don't really know how common ring-exchange is in ceremony. I have, however, met characters who wore rings and were unmarried. Is that OOC influence?

I think it would be worse to say "no weddings can have rings because it's an OOC influence." That would be even more of an OOC influence, arbitrarily deciding that a ring is less acceptable than a bracelet or necklace or trowel for pledging one's troth.

[Nick]

You cannot escape some influence from the outside world, because we must use outside language, and with language comes ideas.
....
I think it would be worse to say "no weddings can have rings because it's an OOC influence." That would be even more of an OOC influence, arbitrarily deciding that a ring is less acceptable than a bracelet or necklace or trowel for pledging one's troth.

I agree, the latter would be OOC influence as well. I wasn't suggesting that.
I was just saying how I hate when people use OOC influences that bluntly.
Like people born and raised in a militaristic town, complaining that someone had no fair trial.

[The Industriallist]

Like people born and raised in a militaristic town, complaining that someone had no fair trial.

Nobody's born and raised anywhere in cantr. Nearly all spawns come into the world with some attitudes, at least. Desire for justice is one of the more common ones.

Now, if you've lived comfortably for 10-20 years in such a place and suddenly start caring about human rights out of the blue, that's a mite suspicious.

[Nick]

Like people born and raised in a militaristic town, complaining that someone had no fair trial.

Nobody's born and raised anywhere in cantr. Nearly all spawns come into the world with some attitudes, at least. Desire for justice is one of the more common ones.

Now, if you've lived comfortably for 10-20 years in such a place and suddenly start caring about human rights out of the blue, that's a mite suspicious.

Well when people should have no concept of democracy demand an election or something similar, it irritates me. And hence the thread.

[The Industriallist]

I think I just encountered the worst example of OOC-influenced behavior I've ever seen. Clearly meant to be funny, but it's painful to the point of my being tempted to post it as a CR breach...I'm not sure if it is, but it's ugly.

I won't say any more about it to avoid hurting the 4-day rule too much.

[nitefyre]

I think I just encountered the worst example of OOC-influenced behavior I've ever seen. Clearly meant to be funny, but it's painful to the point of my being tempted to post it as a CR breach...I'm not sure if it is, but it's ugly.

I won't say any more about it to avoid hurting the 4-day rule too much.

I hate it when people impose on other people's creativity and ingenuity by trying to make people play strictly, without a sense of pleasure and freedom, within the capital rule.

Sometimes people, if I can actually call any of you that, tend to forget that this is only a game.

Afterall, any IC implementation has its basis OOCly, sadly enough.

[Lumin]

Wow, suddenly sensing some hostility here.

Something that's "just a game" isn't worth getting this upset about, wouldn't you agree?

[Nick]

Nitefyre sounds like he needs a nap...

[nitefyre]

That's odd, I don't feel grumpy or the effects of lacking sleep.

[wichita]

Both of my married characters have actually had nice IC philosophical discussions about what it means to be married before they finally made a declaration. It was a lot of fun from that point of view, in light of some of the other wedding talk and ceremonies going on around them.

Concepts that came out in discussion involved how do they feel about each other, how they wanted to respond to their love, what promises they were making to each other in starting the relationship, and how they wanted to go about publicly making their intent to be married to the others around them.

I guess both of my couples have decided that their promise to each other is the most important formality to the relationship, and felt that the best way to share that intent with everyone was to just make a grand announcement. There was a change of last names involved because the women felt that would signify that the two spouses consider themselves to be one united couple now, and only one ring was exchanged from husband to wife in one wedding to represent the love that he promised to surround her with and the value he was willing to put into the relationship. In both instances, all involved were discussing what it meant before just blindly jumping into the OOC rituals asociated with Western marriage cermonies.

Were the ideas borrowed from OOC. Yes.
Did they still have IC roots as well? Yes.

I hate grey areas. Grey areas cause too many problems, too many arguments and b.s. debates. We should color the grey areas, bring more puce and teal and earwax-yellow into the world, lively the place a bit. Instead of saying marriage we could call it ligFSA. Or instead of commanders we could have oifjkeho;iheas. Yes I just randomly punched buttons on the keyboard. I can't tell what words in the dictionary I am allowed to use anymore. Yes it is late and I am cranky, so I am going to go sleep now. Later, ya'll.

[Revanael]

I have no problem with things being called weddings. I have a large problem with said weddings being entirely ripped off from real life christian ceremonies.

Every. Single. One.

I know players who had planned IC a completely different wedding. (As mentioned above.) Anyone can manage enough imagination to do something different. Why should there necessarily be marriage at all?

[glitterdown]

I had the pleasure of witnessing a wedding that didn't involve rings. The parties made lavish gifts of a myriad sort (mostly clothing and decorative accoutremants) but no rings. It was one of the best ceremonies I'd witnessed, mostly because I felt the people involved developed the relationship realistically...

... I didn't hate it though, so this continues to be off-topic.