Sjoftich: the Communist thread

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social moth
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Postby social moth » Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:26 pm

wulf wrote:Is it really a CRB to call a building 'Hogwarts'? I suppose it could be construed as tempting people to look round for Harry, Hermoine and Ron but, taken out of the real life context, it's just another name, no better or worse than, say, 'Pigzits'.

It does seem a bit out of place when I look at it from a RL perspective but so does the idea of cars when most of the people my characters encounter are still sub-stone age in technology! From a character's point of view, it's just another name.

Wulf


Yes, but "Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardy"? That would require that the charecter create witchcraft and wizardy along with the school.
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Postby wulf » Tue Jan 18, 2005 10:56 am

Yes... thinking about it, you're right about the "witchcraft and wizardry" part. Any, "Pigzits" probably is a better name.... ;)

Wulf
Riddrev
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Postby Riddrev » Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:45 am

wulf wrote:Any, "Pigzits" probably is a better name.... ;)


More accurate at least anyway.
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Jos Elkink
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Postby Jos Elkink » Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:50 pm

social moth wrote:Yes, but "Hogwarts School of Witchcraft and Wizardy"? That would require that the charecter create witchcraft and wizardy along with the school.


Or at least makes people think (s)he does :) ...
Antichrist_Online
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Postby Antichrist_Online » Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:00 pm

The funny thing is, Sjoftich is already virtually comunist, people get food when they need it, get clothes when they want, get jobs, living space and protected whenever they are ready. Communism working unlike in real life.
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Pirog
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Postby Pirog » Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:50 pm

Not to mention the Order of the Kept, dedicating their time to aiding people in need and helping the community...
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Just A Bill
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Postby Just A Bill » Thu Jan 27, 2005 1:51 pm

I would have to disagree that Sjoftich is communist. While I have only one character there, and he has not been in town for long, he has not been put upon by the government in any way. No taxes, demands to work a certain project, nothing.

</rant>
There is a difference between charity and communism. With charity, aid for those in need is voluntary, with communism it is given at the point of a gun.

In fact I am of the opinion that charity is a necessary part of any democratic, capitalistic society. Some people will from time to time have needs that they cannot meet. If private charitites meet them then the government will not need to. Unfortunately, private charaties often do not get the recognitionthey deserve leading people to turn to the government with every need they have.

A recent exaple of this is the tsunami aid. As a percent of GDP the US government contribution is below that of many other nations, leading to criticism in the world community. However when look at total funds provided by both government and private charities, the picture looks much different.

Part of a belief in freedom is that the individual should be free to do what he/she chooses with his/her money. Including using it for the betterment of society. There is virtue in me giving aid to those in need. Much of that virtue disappears when the money is taken from me by force and given to those in need.

</rant>
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Doodle_Jack
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Postby Doodle_Jack » Thu Jan 27, 2005 2:57 pm

Sounds to me like Sjoftich isn't communistic nor kapitalistic. It sounds to me like they are social democratic, having a well organized social security system. Something kapitalism doesn't really have (if you work hard enough, you will make it; if you don't make it, you haven't worked hard enough) and which communism likes to enforce on people (don't try to improve your life; we will improve it for you. Honest, we will!)
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Postby swymir » Fri Jan 28, 2005 12:58 am

I use the US Census's Random Name Generator to come up with my names. I take the first name that appears at the top and based on if it's male or female that's what I make. One time I screwed up and picked a male name for a female I made. After about 2 years of introducing herself as a male she suddenly changed it.
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Nick
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Postby Nick » Fri Jan 28, 2005 7:18 am

social moth wrote:I think it is really simple actually. Names from OOC are OK as long as the person, place, or thing they're associated with doesn't influence what you do IC.

However, my personal opinion is that names should be somewhat creative. Even obscure OOC charecter names are nice. It's even kind of interesting when people pull an in game irony. Like if someone named "Mother Teresa" was a iron fisted tyrant who raped and pillaged.

Oh, speaking of which: Can there be rape in Cantr?
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Nick
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Postby Nick » Fri Jan 28, 2005 7:19 am

social moth wrote:I think it is really simple actually. Names from OOC are OK as long as the person, place, or thing they're associated with doesn't influence what you do IC.

However, my personal opinion is that names should be somewhat creative. Even obscure OOC charecter names are nice. It's even kind of interesting when people pull an in game irony. Like if someone named "Mother Teresa" was a iron fisted tyrant who raped and pillaged.

Oh, speaking of which: Can there be rape in Cantr?


Yeah, speaking of Mother Theresa, can there be rape in Cantr?
:?: :!: :shock: :!: :?:
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Jur Schagen
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Postby Jur Schagen » Fri Jan 28, 2005 12:23 pm

Come on guys... no OOC culture? What about marriages? Sex? The employment concept? Code of conduct (adressing people with "sir", saying "thank you", etc)? Religion? Mercenaries, pirates, warriors, soldiers, with their respective behaviour? All OOC culture that gets into the game and is widely accepted...

Truth is, we all are so indoctrinated with OOC culture that we couldn't possibly play the game with scratch IC culture. We often don't even recognize it when it blends in because it's so natural to us... in fact I can sometimes recognize if a char is American or European, and not by language errors or online hours.

Having said that, I don't like the Hogwarts reference.

In my opinion, the only truly IC culture that exists has to do with random deaths and the sleeping disease, and the other player's interest for his character. Our chars look upon the death of other chars with much less compassion (except for the few respected community members that die) then, say, we do at the tsunami victims. They bury them (or not) and move on. Life is cheap (just hit the spawn button), so death is cheap too. We, the players, know that, and so the characters inevitably act upon that too.

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Postby The Industriallist » Fri Jan 28, 2005 8:18 pm

Marriages are too common for OOC reasons, I would say. But they aren't inherently OOC; it's plausible that two people would want to be 'permanently' bonded that way, and 'marriage' is the english word for it.

Sex I think is OOC, but you'll never sell that to the people or the PD. It's all a matter of what cantrian biology is like, which we can't properly tell.

I hardly think the idea of getting other people to do your work for you is an OOC one...

Code of conduct (as you mean it)...I've been figuring some of that comes with the language, which is imported in full from OOC. You may have some point there though.

Religion...look around. Do you actually subscribe to the theory that all real-world religeons were caused by divine interventions? Because otherwise there's nothing OOC about people piecing together belief systems from nothing. I have complaints (lots of them) about how it's often done, but not about the fact that it is.

If the complaint about fighting men is things like militaries automatically getting all "sir, yes, sir!", and pirates sliding toward pirate-speak (though I've never seen anyone actually go there) and things like that...yes, that looks a lot OOC. If you mean the idea of people taking all those roles...soldier used to mean 'guy who caarries a weapon he doesn't own' in Cantr, now it's becoming a position logically derived from the tiredness system. Mercenary always made sense, though I doubt it's ever worked well. Piracy is obvious to anyone with a dishonest bone in their bodies the moment they see how a ship functions.

In my opinion, the only truly IC culture that exists has to do with random deaths and the sleeping disease, and the other player's interest for his character. Our chars look upon the death of other chars with much less compassion (except for the few respected community members that die) then, say, we do at the tsunami victims. They bury them (or not) and move on. Life is cheap (just hit the spawn button), so death is cheap too. We, the players, know that, and so the characters inevitably act upon that too.

I would contend that life is IC cheap for a number of reasons. One...no matter what you do, you see many many people die of the sleeping sickness. Mostly people who you only really notice because they clutter the ground where they fall, but a good thickening of people who've at least spoken a few times. Two, there is little culture of nationalism, humanism, whatever (naturally)...the biggest really cohesive IC groups would be small tribes IRL. You don't have any ties to the vast majority of people, so if they die, what should you feel but 'ooh, loot!'? Finally...people have been selling their lives cheaply for a very long time. The only deterrants to that are actual reasons to live...which many cantr characters don't have much of. If your life isn't that great, risking it isn't riking much.
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Lumin
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Postby Lumin » Fri Jan 28, 2005 10:42 pm

Part of the reason people may be so casual about death is the fact that most of the time, characters that die have made no actual effort to live. If someone's murdered or something it's much more dramatic, but speaking both IC and OOC, it's hard to muster up much sympathy for the passing of yet another 'man in his twenties' who has been standing there completely silent and not even bothering to gather food since the day he was spawned.

I don't know about everybody else, but when I look at the 'People' list I always judge the size of a town by the number of people in their thirties or older. I pretty much count anyone in their twenties as a non-entity, unless I see them talking or happen to notice they're carrying a shield or a weapon. (which I know is somewhat hypocrital since just about all of my characters are women in their twenties who seem weak and are wearing nothing worth mentioning...)

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