Is it really that bad?

[Lumin]

I lost my last account due to inactivity right before the changes hit, and I just registered for a new one today. Only now, after browsing the forums a bit I'm wondering if I should even bother right now, and instead waith for the problems to be ironed out.

I mean, Cantr has always been a slow-paced game, but with the way tiredness works it sounds like it's going from requiring patient and dedicated players to requiring catotonic ones who don't bother logging in very often because there's nothing to do. It doesn't seem very realistic, and if (as I've gathered) there really isn't anyway to significantly speed up recovery, I don't understand the reasoning behind implementing a problem without also adding a solution at the same time. (And if there is a "cure" and it just hasn't been discovered yet, it still doesn't make a lot of sense. How do you cure tireness? You sleep. Neanderthals could do it, animals can do it; it doesn't require a lot of rational thought or building a bed or anything like that.)

And the item deteriation just sounds...well, I was always a supporter of that idea, but only if it were implemented in a balanced way that made sense, and again I of course assumed the whole system would be put into place at once, including repairs, instead of just the first part with no way to do anything about it.

So right now it sounds pretty bad, but I'm just looking for opinions or clarifications from people who have played recently. If there are known problems, are fixes expected soon? Ever? Are the problems even seen as problems by the people in charge of fixing them? Is the game broken right now or not? I dunno, from what I've read, at the very least it sounds like drastic changes were perhaps made a bit hastily without their consequences being tested or thought out very thoroughly beforehand...

[Black Canyon]

Well, I'm a die-hard Cantr fan and an eternal optimist..... so it would take more than these things for me to give it up. It is true that I have problems with the recovery rate at this time. I'm also not crazy about the fact that the shiney new composite recurve bow that my character made all on her own is now used.

I believe, however, that the issues regarding tiredness (especially the recovery from tiredness) will be corrected in time. And the same goes for the deterioration issues. But probably the thing that bothers me most as a player is the loss of other established players and hence the loss of significant characters that my characters interact with and have relationships with. Because to me it is mostly about the interactions between characters and the development of those relationships that make the game fun.

[Neelix]

I just joined Cantr about a month ago and at first I was all about discovering what was possible, finding out what machines do, how I can build stuff, etcetera. The newness of that wears off after a couple of weeks and you see that most of the players actually play for the interactions between players and not so much with the world of Cantr.

It's still interesting to build stuff and everything, but most players don't really care so much about it. And adding new features that are a burden to the player and without also inserting a way for them to fix it, is a sure way to scare away players.

I think it would be better to implement features that allow players to interact in other ways, instead of just adding new machines, appliances and whatever.

[Cherize]

Even with it's flaws, Cantr is still the best game of this type out there.

Tiredness is a pain in the butt, but it has cut way down on the hack and slash crowd.

[Agar]

You can't forget that there is also no natural healing now. If you're hurt, you HAVE to find something to eat to get your strength back, you cannot just eat regular and rest.

So to recap recent "improvments" - You get tired doing things, you don't heal when you're injured, and anything you make rots away.

[mikki]

Agar... You wouldn't be complaining now would you...



EDITED: I haven't complained about the game yet.. *sighs* here it goes then.. I have been playing also for some time and it is irritating to where I am not wanting to play some of my char's because they are laying around doing nothing because they are too tired.. The animals are attacking and killing us faster than we are able to do it to them.. It is very annoying that the weapons that My char's have worked so hard to make are already used, and going along with used I have also seen a difference in how well they work when used to hunt..

so even though I was picking on you, Agar.. I do have to agree... It is a pain...

[Neelix]

So to recap recent "improvments" - You get tired doing things, you don't heal when you're injured, and anything you make rots away.

To summarize that even shorter:

Life sucks, even in Cantr.

[mortaine]

Yes. I joined Cantr just shortly after tiredness and healing and one-hit-per day were implemented, so I haven't been on for all that long, I feel. Also, iron had just recently become nigh-impossible to obtain, yet most objects in the game are made from the stuff, and no way to recycle it.

Agar also forgets illness: people can get sick and die now, too.

But basically, all the changes have been to introduce entropy with no way to reverse the process of degeneration. Cantr is a world in decline.

I have to say, as a homeowner in RL, I fight entropy every day. I don't play computer games to fight entropy online-- it's why I don't really play the Sims anymore. The basics to survive take all my characters' time and energy. What's the point of role-playing if next week there's going to be some new "improvement" that means my character's going to have one more way to fail to thrive?

Oh, my favorite thing recently (yes, more griping about the broken animal system): 1000 g of a healing food to heal 30% of my character's injuries. You can harvest 25 g of this food per day. Guess how long it takes for ONE boar to hit the character for 30% damage? Guess how long it takes for every person in town to hit the boar for 30% damage? Guess how many hits the boars get per day (there are 7 boars)? Here's a hint: we're losing.

Someone in another thread said basically "Jos said it would take a total re-write of the animals to implement taming them" and my response is "and this is bad how?!?"

Is Cantr that bad? To be honest.... yes. I have three characters I actually like playing. I should just let the rest die and leave exquisite corpses for the rest of you to bury.

[Bowser]

I have characters in their sixties now. I have played through many changes. Each change took a day or so to get used to and adjust. Some changes have been great and others have been annoying, but all are a part of life... change.

Tiredness and healing aren't that big a deal to me.

My biggest issue is that as each year passes, more and more changes are implimented with the purpose to hinder a single person's production. I understand in a society simulator you would want to foster cooperation, but it is starting to take too long to get anything done.

Iron could be smelted to steel, now you need to crush the pre-iron, smelt the pre-iron, then smelt the steel. Cars used to need glass, now the glass needs to be made and then processed more. A crossbow takes a lot of resources to make and seems to go from brand new to used after a few years, even if you never shoot it. Cars better not become used, it takes too long to make for it to not work after a few years.

It was a slow paced game two years ago, and it gets slower each day.

[Agar]

I'm repeating myself here, but can you imagine how hard it will be to find these new resources that are exclusivly on new lands when you have a "brand new galleon"?

It's got a lot of wood in it ... making it rot fast by what we have to go by according to current rotting models. You might be able to get to a new land, but then you'd need to make stone hammers and collect enough wood to make a longboat, then build that on hope it doesn't rot out from under you on the way back.

[west]

in real life, boats are built to withstand rot.

[Chrissy]

I was nervous at first about the changes, but then I played this playstation game called Okage: The Shadow King, and I think I saw the vision for Cantr. And I like it. It of course, I presume, would not be as graphic, but the concept is the same. I like the changes. It makes me view the game from a more technical perspective, making it even more fun

C.

[swymir]

The only problem I have had with any of the changes is how tiredness doens't heal back fast enough, but truely the only characters I have suffering from that were characters I had on repeat projects. None of my newer characters have over 10% tiredness. All the rest of the stuff people are complaining about is bull. Iron is not impossible to make. Sure it is now harder, but if you remember steel used to be harvested from the ground just like iron. I am sure people complained when that was changed and people said it would take forever to make steel, but guess what people got used to it and steel was made is most cities. Right now iron is not hard to make once you ge tused to the new conditions. Really there is only two extra steps. You have to crush hematite and then smelt (JUST LIKE IN REAL-LIFE) With most suggestions on the forum asking to make cantr more realistic people shouldn't complain when they do. The changes are not that bad and if your character is still recovering from the beginning when it was first implemented. Than I can guarenteee that you have been working as you gain 4% health back every day doing nothing. This means it would take a little over a year (Cantr time) to heal all the way back to a hundread. (If you were at 100% fatigue) At that point you just have to start larger projects and tiredness isn't that big of a deal. As for diseases they too aren't a problem. Sure they hurt tiredness, but I don't think anyone has died from having the disease. Just like in REAL-LIFE people who are sick have to be cared for by those who are feeling well. When you have the flu do you go outside and dig up stone? No you stay in bed (which I hope will be implemented soon) and wait to get better. It lasts a week or two and then you are fine. I also wouldn't worry about losing your items because they have not instituted a way to repair items yet. I am sure that they will pause deterioration if it gets to close and things aren't ready. And just to let you know it's been about 3-4 years Cantr time that items have been able to deteriorate and the worst thing is bows which are *used* Does anyone know if items even dissapear if they are completly broken? Maybe they just aren't useable. I am sure they can still be repaired or at least they should be. Recently there has been a lot of complaining and a lot of people quitting and I have supported everything that has been added recently.

[mortaine]

I find it interesting that the people who have "no problem" with the current difficulty are all long-time players, presumably with characters who have things and tools already to make their lives easier. In fact, the boasting in these threads ("I have secured a nearly-unlimited supply of limestone!") gets really sickening to those of us who spend 90% of our newbie characters' time trying to get enough food and healing food to stay alive for just another couple of days.

I recently put together a few resource maps (all of which were available to a character) and figured out that, on the entire continent where 1/2 of my characters are, the resources needed in order to make iron (not even steel, just iron) are scattered all over the continent and only occur in THREE places. Not three places each. THREE places total. If you know how to make iron, you know what that means. Essentially, you need to be a very seasoned traveller in order to gather enough resources to make, say, a spearhead.

This is also on a continent where the animals apparently only eat human flesh. They never eat each other and are so aggressive, you cannot collect more than one day's food outside without getting attacked by something large and vicious that takes you down 30% of your total in one bite.

Oh, yes, indeed. I'm sure you would have no problem with that.

[Agar]

I also wouldn't worry about losing your items because they have not instituted a way to repair items yet. I am sure that they will pause deterioration if it gets to close and things aren't ready.

*Falls on the floor in laughter*

Mortaine, it almost sounds like you're describing Aki, except you would be a part of a much more together community. I'm guessing you're around Krif and the Sacred Lions. But just guessing.

I only know of one landmass with only one of each of the three resources you need for iron on it with a population. I know of another landmass with the same problem, but last time I'd heard anything about it, everyone on it was deaded. If I'm right, the land mass you're talking about has bigger probelms on it than travel to gather resources. Once that's all done, it shouldn't be that hard to get iron.

If you're not on that island, Then you have bad maps. Try harder