why?

[Faith]

Its deteriorating rapidly

19/09/2011

English 296 1782
Polish 335 1754
Total 795 4659

Spanish 52 442

We are the third group and we were 70 a couple of months ago............

[Jaxon]

What this game needs is balancing, and making it a fair but still slow paced game. I seriously don't believe in the hack'n'slash version that you seem to be looking for. It is after all a society simulator, not a FPS.

I agree. Balancing. If people want to be well defended, they should be allowed to be. But if someone wants to be well armed and able to kill a bunch of poorly defended people, they should be allowed to be.

The goal of the game is to create societies. Societies are made for the main purpose of defending the populace.

[gejyspa]

Really? I would assume that, while defense is certainly one aspect of society, that main purpose that societies are made is because everyone has different talents, and can't do everything themselves.

[EchoMan]

Any philosopher would cringe at "societies are made for the main purpose of defending the populace".

One of the primary purposes of society is the formation of an organized group of individuals, who can support each other in various ways. It is in those difficult times that you realize the importance of being a part of society. It is the members of your social group who come forward to render all the help you need. The support given by society can be of the physical, emotional, financial or medical form.

A society, or a human society, is a group of people related to each other through persistent relations, or a large social grouping sharing the same geographical or virtual territory, subject to the same political authority and dominant cultural expectations. Human societies are characterized by patterns of relationships (social relations) between individuals who share a distinctive culture and institutions; a given society may be described as the sum total of such relationships among its constituent members. In social sciences, a society invariably entails social stratification and/or dominance hierarchy.

...

More broadly, a society may be described as an economic, social, or industrial infrastructure, made up of a varied collection of individuals. Members of a society may be from different ethnic groups. A society can be a particular ethnic group, such as the Saxons; a nation state, such as Bhutan; or a broader cultural group, such as a Western society. The word society may also refer to an organized voluntary association of people for religious, benevolent, cultural, scientific, political, patriotic, or other purposes. A "society" may even, though more by means of metaphor, refer to a social organism such as an ant colony or any cooperative aggregate such as, for example, in some formulations of artificial intelligence.

[IvanicDiazinum]

Really? I would assume that, while defense is certainly one aspect of society, that main purpose that societies are made is because everyone has different talents, and can't do everything themselves.

Which, namely, is one of the biggest problems in Cantr. That is... we pretty much can do everything ourselves. No fear of death, no great difference in the time it takes for an expert to complete a task versus a novice, and no difference in final quality.
I would so as far as to dare suggest that rather than bother with quality, which would open up its own can of worms and lead us down a WoW-type road that I don't think we want to go down... why not just make the skill difference more profound? Say, double the difference. Triple it even.
I mean, why is it at the level it is now? I'm not aware of the actual numbers, I don't even know if anyone is because that's not in the Wiki anywhere I've seen. But is there a stated reason for not giving experts more advantage?

[Addicted]

20% plus and minus is what I've seen and heard discussed. But as you know, it effects time and not quality.

[gejyspa]

Really? I would assume that, while defense is certainly one aspect of society, that main purpose that societies are made is because everyone has different talents, and can't do everything themselves.

Which, namely, is one of the biggest problems in Cantr. That is... we pretty much can do everything ourselves. No fear of death, no great difference in the time it takes for an expert to complete a task versus a novice, and no difference in final quality.
I would so as far as to dare suggest that rather than bother with quality, which would open up its own can of worms and lead us down a WoW-type road that I don't think we want to go down... why not just make the skill difference more profound? Say, double the difference. Triple it even.
I mean, why is it at the level it is now? I'm not aware of the actual numbers, I don't even know if anyone is because that's not in the Wiki anywhere I've seen. But is there a stated reason for not giving experts more advantage?

Personally, I would agree with you. But I think the effect that we already see -- "Oh, I'm not good at fighting, I guess I will do something stupid that will get people to kill me"-- would be even more pronounced. People (other than me) want to play the type of character they want to play (and I say this without any kind of disdain or prejudice -- they are certainly entitled to enjoy themselves), so anything they perceive as an impediment to that is resisted.

[Jaxon]

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

The U.S. was founded by fighting a revolution and the Constitution is based on securing the rights of the people. Such rights are protected through force more often than not.

To completely disregard the impact that violence has on society is obtuse.

[Mr. Bones]

Really? I would assume that, while defense is certainly one aspect of society, that main purpose that societies are made is because everyone has different talents, and can't do everything themselves.

Which, namely, is one of the biggest problems in Cantr. That is... we pretty much can do everything ourselves. No fear of death, no great difference in the time it takes for an expert to complete a task versus a novice, and no difference in final quality.
I would so as far as to dare suggest that rather than bother with quality, which would open up its own can of worms and lead us down a WoW-type road that I don't think we want to go down... why not just make the skill difference more profound? Say, double the difference. Triple it even.
I mean, why is it at the level it is now? I'm not aware of the actual numbers, I don't even know if anyone is because that's not in the Wiki anywhere I've seen. But is there a stated reason for not giving experts more advantage?

Personally, I would agree with you. But I think the effect that we already see -- "Oh, I'm not good at fighting, I guess I will do something stupid that will get people to kill me"-- would be even more pronounced. People (other than me) want to play the type of character they want to play (and I say this without any kind of disdain or prejudice -- they are certainly entitled to enjoy themselves), so anything they perceive as an impediment to that is resisted.

I think the differences are profound enough for me. I can easily see the difference in my "novice" characters and my "experts". With an expert you could complete a 1 day job in about half a day, with a terribly awkward player it might take them about 2 days to complete. 2 is four times as much as 1/2, so what you are saying, doubling and tripling efficiency is already in effect. I really don't think there is a need for any additional handicap on this.

[Faith]

I'm making a raker alone with a novice char in that ability, BELIVE ME, there is difference. She was working around one year and only have 50%.

And I like the game like is now, If you want war and want to start one...ok, make your brain works. You can have really interesting conspiracies, started for a char that finally killed a whole city alone and without a hit or drag...just ussing the brain! Ok, It takes a lot of "real" months, but hey! That's the fun! And when you finally achieve something like this after a lot of months working on it and seeing how your char grows and changes, is like: "Wow! I'm a God!!!"

There are enough "hit hit hit" games around, don't ruin something unique like cantr.

[masterekat]

And you could always just RP violence. Of course it would require willing victims.

[Jaxon]

You guys like cantr the way it is, but clearly most people are bored with the game.

Conflict is not only a necessary part of society, it's a necessary part of gaming society. Few if any conflicts are started these days and that's why I'm about to delete my account. It's all work work work work, but for what? I especially hate doing work when I know the work I'm doing is just adding to a massive stockpile that a guy is never going to use anyways.

If people love their land and their resources so much, they should have to work harder to protect them. Bottom line. The last threat to any society was my brother, even if he did it through brutal tactics (and killed 2 of my chars for no reason).

[Doug R.]

Your brother was the historical equivalent of Attila the Hun, who brought destruction across Europe and Asia with absolutely no cultural or societal benefit. Killing for killing's sake is stupid, and counter-productive. We lost way more players because of what he did than we kept, and before you dispute that, remember I have access to the stats and you don't. You are also under the mistaken impression that all conflict needs to be physical. That is far from the truth. The Cold war was probably the most intense period of our world's recent history, and not a single shot was ever (directly) fired between the principle players.

[SumBum]

The last threat to any society was my brother...

I disagree. His exploit was only well-known because of the shittiness of it. There are plenty of REAL conflicts ongoing right now that have actual RP behind them. Threats/conflicts are far more interesting and challenging when they don't involve one group swooping in and wiping out an entire town in 5 minutes.

[Rebma]

Your brother was the historical equivalent of Atilla the Hun......

Even Attilla took time to rape and pillage and stuff before and during rampages