Ammo

[nitefyre]

I've suggested this earlier inside different topics, and I believe others have also taken a look at it, so I think it needs its own topic now.

As Pirog mentions oft- deterioration is in the works- it'd be nice to have another figure of realism. This can do a great deal to even out the combat system (lessening the effectiveness of 1 man massacres)

Ammunition needed for the artillery weapons (bows) in conjunction of deterioration of the bladed weapons.


I also heard nails being introduced so the concept of individual tiny items would work well. If nails are produced in large amounts, so should ammo:

Just an example:

For 10 Crossbow Bolts: 50 grams of steel, 200 grams of iron

For 10 Warbow arrows: 50 grams of iron, 500 grams of wood

For 10 Hunting Bow arrows: 50 grams of stone, 500 grams of wood, or 50 grams of small bones, 500 grams of wood.

If nails are Individually made, I guess so should ammo and probably from a similar machine:

Bolt: 5 grams of steel, 20 grams of iron

Warbow Arrow: 5 grams of iron, 50 grams of wood

Hunting Bow opts: 5 bone or 5 stone, 50 wood.

Oh and for sling shots and similar weapons as well. Perhaps for them, they could have a handicap removed, like a slower deterioration rate then blades, or pump up the power a bit.

[Revanael]

50g wood for one arrow? When the bow is only 500g? A little much, I think... Bear in mind, the hunting bow is the most common weapon, even in almost woodless areas.

Also, the hunting bow should accept sharpened wood arrows, maybe doing less damage.

Slings should fire both stone (5g? maybe 10g?) and iron (same) shot, with higher damage for the iron. Maybe make it 10g stone but no work needed, and 5g iron which needs shaping.

[AoM]

Ammo is a bad idea. A person can hit and hit with a sabre, getting more effective. But everytime a person practices with a warbow, they'll lose resources and time.

~AoM

[Spectrus_Wolfus]

when ranged attacks come in i agree ammo would be a good idea but until that time noway as it just makes getting a decent and effective weapon all the harder

[Claivuus]

That's the fun in playing the game, though. It makes it more like a common situation that people come across IRL

[SekoETC]

Though arrows make the game a bit harder, I think they are a good addition. There could be poisoned arrows also. And I think you should be able to shoot primitive arrows also with warbow.
If a skill system is added, you could practice with cheaper arrows made of plain wood, shooting at a lifeless target. So you wouldn't waste valuable iron arrows.
Think about for example Lord of the Rings, I bet there were excellent bows but when they run out of arrows, they collected crude orcish arrows from the ground.
There's one thing, an arrow would have a high chance to end up on the ground without breaking if the archer missed the target. Also if it killed the target, it might end up in the inventory in some of the cases (40% or so) as the archer would pull it out.
Arrows with feathers would fly more straight, so they would be more likely to hit, or if there's no random factor then would cause more damage.
And you should also be able to strike with the bow.. the damage being the same as for some kind of a cane I should think. Chance of breaking would sure be bigger than in shooting.

[nitefyre]

Ammo is a bad idea. A person can hit and hit with a sabre, getting more effective. But everytime a person practices with a warbow, they'll lose resources and time.

~AoM

Yeah, as I said, its for in conjunction with deterioration. AoM, you didn't read the handicap bit did you? When deterioration comes into play, bow like items can maybe have lesser deterioration, or better strike damage by like a percent or two of a blade of equal proportions. Its not a suggestion for immediate implementation, its a future ponderer for the RD.

Sekoetc nailed it on the head, variants of arrows can be used. What about those crazy ones where they light arrows with fires. Like in LoTR as well I believe.

Look at any military conflict in history, and see how supplies like ammo/food are not an important matter. I don't like crossbowing air. To

[SekoETC]

Mainly the biggest advantage of using a bow is the distance. Now in Cantr we cannot use this since everyone excists in the same location. There should be some kind of a grid system and it would completely change the game.
Off topic!!.. This makes me think about dimension. In real life, three dimensions if not counting time. Cantr, two dimensions Except that in cities only one dimension. It's like a space pocket. And houses are pockets in the pocket. All in one spot and still not in or on each other. In real world this would be impossible.. or is it? Think about where all the socks go for instance, do they get sucked into a universal little gap? *Insert X-files music*

[Spectrus_Wolfus]

seko do a search of the general discusion for jos's idea on version 2 of cantr and see what he has in mind that way

[nitefyre]

seko do a search of the general discusion for jos's idea on version 2 of cantr and see what he has in mind that way

Something we didn't know, *xfiles music volumes up* Jos and Seko are co-conspirers to form more dimensions and grids to the Cantr world which, as we all know, are connected by single path lines which we would never be able to venture off.

[AoM]

I'm aware of the idea of deterioration. But there should and probably will be ways to repair that deterioration. In addition, both bows and swords can deteriorate.

As far as I'm concerned, until distance becomes a factor, and bows and x-bows can be used to shoot out of locked buildings or something with no fear of an attack back, I consider bows just another weapon.

People argue on these forums whether water in Cantr is solid or liquid; I'll argue that a bow and sword are just two methods of dealing damage, one doing more than the other. Implement range, then implement ammo.

~AoM

[Piscator]

I'm surprised that this discussion rests for almost tree years now.

Not only that ammunition would be a great way to diversify the Cantr arsenal a little bit more, it would also be a way to get a more realistic economy. Currently the only thing that's actually consumed is food. Everything else lasts practically forever, provided it is repaired regularly. If the overall population keeps stagnant, somewhere in the near future all needs (except for food) will be satisfied. Creating a need for ammunition could keep the Cantrian economy alive beyond that point.

Of course it would be necessary to adjust the game balance in favor of ranged weapons (e.g. by adding some damage, implementing range categories, improving their accuracy etc), but I think some distinction between ranged and melee weapons will be implemented sooner or later anyway.

Finally ammunition could make gunpowder weapon suitable for Cantr, provided that cartridges are really expensive.

[Antono Flavio]

Can't you just pick up your arrows after using them?

[Piscator]

Good point. But you wouldn't be able to use all of them. Some arrows will go missing, some will brake or get damaged otherwise. Seko already suggested that you should be able to reuse a percentage of your arrows.

I'm in favour of 0% because it would be the easiest to implement.

[sanchez]

I'm in favour of expendable resources, other than food and fuels. But I'd rather see a new weapon, like a small cannon or something that gets rid of iron.