Re-inenforced secure doors, picks etc - A door overhaul idea

[Drael]

Okay this is more a general idea than a specific suggestion, around a rehaul of doors.

1) If regular doors/locks could be broken into with a screwdriver (inside only), crowbar, battering ram (Wood project, heavy object, bashes doors fast but requires a load of people to use), simple primitive lock pick (wood, bone etc, takes a long time), and steel lock pick, as well as just plain brute force over time.

2) Reinforced secure doors can only be broken into with a ram, crowbar, or a steel lock pick (takes a long time). Secure doors require iron and steel, can only be built for a car/van type vehicle, or on a building. Requires a fair bit of iron steel for one on a building.

3) Locks can made be one way, so people can enter one way without a key, or leave. Vehicles would have this as standard, with an option to switch "internal locks" on, like a child safety, for transporting criminals. This way, no more dragging is needed for people getting off cars, only on, and people dont get trapped in buildings as often. Most real world locks are one way except in prisons.

4) Lock picks don't destroy the lock, only switch it to unlocked.

5) Combination locks that use a four digit entry, and thus cannot have keys stolen for.

6) Multiple locks (one of each type allowed). Can add combination to a two way, and one way lock. This way, one can switch one way on and off, and back up a code with a key - extra secure. The two locks use the same key (so that its not overkill). Crowbar and ram can bypass any locks in one go, and picking cant do combination locks.

7) Locked containers - such as breifcases, silos, small vaults etc. Extra security for individual objects.

Chain locks. Can wrap a chain lock around certain things, such as machines so they cant be used, bicycles, unlocked doors, some containers without locks etc. Chain locks provide extra security for those with bicycles, containers and ships that cant use reinforced secure doors. Chain locks can be also combination locks, requiring four digits, so they cant be picked, but can still be broken with a crowbar, or brute force given a long time. Ship chain locks, a variant, are particulary heavy, and can only be broken with a crowbar, or picked with a steel lock pick. Chain locks used to secure a ship, or bike, do not prohibit "entry" to open spaces thereof.

9) Shackles. A stationary machine to which a person can be tied, so they cannot escape (Assuming some movement here, so projects and such is still okay).

10) Chain locks, locked containers and shackles are the same as regular doors and can be picked/broken as with normal doors. (via force, picks simple or steel, ram, screwdriver and crowbar)

11) Only the holder of the given vehicles key, can move a engine powered vehicle, even if its unlocked, unless a "hotwire" project is completed, which takes one half of a day.

12) Bicycles no longer have entry locks to them. Ships do not have entry locks, only to their cabins etc (those can be enforced secure doors too). They are secured via the chains, and possessions are secured by being below deck, or off the bike. Rickshaws and bikes, carts etc, can have a lock installed on their storage space. For bikes this is smaller than the total weight allowance, for rickshaws, it is the same as the weight allowance.

Makes doors a bit less potent, without opening them easily to theives, by adding extra layers of protection, and adds much realism, fexibility and complexity to the whole issue. Solves some issues I think too.

Thoughts?

[phoenixannwn]

needs a little more balance. I understand you want to protect things, but you still need to have the option to be able to raise hell for the same cost.
for every lock, a lockpick sort of thing (metaphorically speaking).

[cooldevo]

I do like some of these as they would add more flexibility into the game....

1) ...simple primitive lock pick (wood, bone etc, takes a long time)...

This would be great for civilizations that don't have access to iron. Instead of corwbaring it could just try to "brute-force" a bone lock (for example) by hitting it to break it in a project that announces to everyone, but take less time.

3) Locks can made be one way, so people can enter one way without a key, or leave. Vehicles would have this as standard, with an option to switch "internal locks" on, like a child safety, for transporting criminals. This way, no more dragging is needed for people getting off cars, only on, and people dont get trapped in buildings as often. Most real world locks are one way except in prisons.

This would be very handy for those that travel with people a lot. Leaving doors unlocked for periods of time until someone wakes up (some towns will not drag someone unless there is a very good reason) is just asking for it to be stolen, and not everyone is awake at the same time.

7) Locked containers - such as breifcases, silos, small vaults etc. Extra security for individual objects.

This could be very handy for securing personal storage, although if it is carryable it could still be picked up and stolen to be broken later.

9) Shackles. A stationary machine to which a person can be tied, so they cannot escape (Assuming some movement here, so projects and such is still okay).

This has been covered in another suggestion thread. But would be good for prisoners and criminals, or slavery.

11) Only the holder of the given vehicles key, can move a engine powered vehicle, even if its unlocked, unless a "hotwire" project is completed, which takes one half of a day.

This can be irritating if you are trying to transport a thief or something you have captured and are trying to return and they keep turning you around. Especially if it takes a bit and they figure out what your normal "awake" patterns are.

[phoenixannwn]

Yeah, especially that last one. No key=can't steer. I don't suppose that'd be okay for boats, too?

[mojomuppet]

Before any time is spent or these extra lock ideas a few key things should be handled, even before the new fight system IMO...

1. This situation with people moving vehicles once they are prisoners...this makes me insanely angry. If I have a car, fuel, lock, key, and ability to drag them into the vehicle I have won already! Some char I have otherwise made completely helpless now has me at odds. If you then put this new fight system in place where I have to attack (again maybe) be made tired (and vulnerable) by attacking someone I would otherwise not have to if I just locked them away to starve to death. What this is doing is forcing my char to try to kill someone that Im trying to rp with. I want some chars to be forced to not give up just because they are in a situation they dont like. I want the chance to force feed a char ( I have done this many times), move it to where ever to be killed ( or judged by it own people), imprisoned, ect. Because it seems more fair to me than having to say well I killed them because I could not transport (this player is forcing lack of rp for others or counting on them to be punished later even though they may not be around). This becomes even more important if you get a hold of a Blackrock, Stone Knight, Silver Knight, or the endless amounts of other places that will go after you for killing one of their own. I for one know for a fact that the way some of these places run you kill one of theirs they can and will wipe out everything you have all the way back to stealing your entombed dead . This intense amount of rp by the actions of a quitter seems unfair. I got you dammit deal with it!

2) Undeveloped lands being robbed over and over. I mean dam if you can put an auto lock on a reed boat be kind enough to put one on at least the simplest buildings. This seems fair to me, and simple for the "boys upstairs" to deal handle.

[EchoMan]

2) We are discussing different varieties of locks, with one very simle and easy to break. Such a lock could come with any new building by default imho. And you should be able to upgrade this lock to a better one.

[berserk9779]

I think there should be 3 kind of locks:

Wooden lock (made of wood and bronze. Available to bronze age civilizations)
It would take 0.5 days per lockpicking attempt.



Iron lock (the lock as it is now)

Steel and bronze lock (Bronze is used nowadays to make stronger locks. two times more resistant than an iron lock. containing steel, it is available only to advanced civilizations. It should take long to build.

Also a very nice addition would be lockpicking without a tool.
It should take 30 times more than using a crowbar and still depend on chance. It could depend on the strength of the character.

I think this would open many interesting RP possibilities, rise the cost and labor needed for holding prisoners and would add to the balance of the new combat system.

[Piscator]

I merged the last post in here since it's pretty much the same topic.

[SumBum]

I think there should be 3 kind of locks:

Wooden lock (made of wood and bronze. Available to bronze age civilizations)
It would take 0.5 days per lockpicking attempt.

Minus the bronze. I don't care if it's a guaranteed break when using the crowbar. Underdeveloped places would probably have just as much luck getting iron as bronze, so why not go with the iron lock? I think all anyone wants is to keep newspawn thieves from running into every building. A very simple wood only lock would prevent those situations. Right now your best bet if you live in a wooded area is to build wooden carts for safe storage. That's silly.

[berserk9779]

And how about lockpicking without a tool?
maybe it could be deactivated for stone buildings, but come on, how long can you keep someone locked in a mud hut? really not forever

[DylPickle]

!

For when building deterioration is implemented: When buildings (and maybe vehicles) reach a certain level disrepair, should their locks pop off/open?

[RedQueen.exe]

I see a problem with combination locks. If the interface actually accepts a number series, someone who gets killed could give the combination to a buddy of theirs that plays a character in or near the town and clean the place out and just claim that they "guessed lucky" (intentionally guessing many incorrect ones first). I think it might work out okay if the combination wasn't actually entered in there, but had some kind of in-game realization... sort of like a note that can't be dropped (on death or otherwise) but that can be handed(as a copy) to other characters and essentially works like a key.

[Polt86]

I I think it might work out okay if the combination wasn't actually entered in there, but had some kind of in-game realization... sort of like a note that can't be dropped (on death or otherwise) but that can be handed(as a copy) to other characters and essentially works like a key.

I suggested this before in another topic on locks, but it was met largely with disagreement.

Edit:

Other combination lock topic

Okay, not largely, but a single disagreement, then discussion sort of died.