Poll: Language Learning

[Jaxon]

This whole "sufficient exposure to learn the language" thing has gone far enough.

We need some concrete rules in place. There is too much ambiguity over what is a CRB with language and what isn't.

I propose we make one of four options as the set in stone rule.

Option 1: A character cannot be bilingual.

Option 2: A character can be automatically bilingual upon spawning.

Option 3: A character can be automatically bilingual after a set amount of time being in another language area.

Option 4: A character must role play learning all of the words that character can use in another language.

If anyone adds any other options fine. But who here is in favor of a concrete rule?

[Rebma]

There is concrete rules. You speak the language you spawned in. You have to spend sufficient time in game "learning" a second language before your character can also be bilingual in that.

I've never had a problem understanding this. And the fact that people report this in the CRB forum, should indicate to you that it's a generally recognized rule. We only see issues with people who don't understand you can't be both right away, or people who seem to think you can't learn another language at all reporting others.

[Jaxon]

We only see issues with people who don't understand you can't be both right away, or people who seem to think you can't learn another language at all reporting others.

What qualifies as learning?

[joo]

What qualifies as learning?

Learning is RP indicating that the character is focusing on learning the language, e.g. establishing the meanings of words and expressions with another character who speaks the language fluently.

[Jaxon]

What qualifies as learning?

Learning is RP indicating that the character is focusing on learning the language, e.g. establishing the meanings of words and expressions with another character who speaks the language fluently.

And how much of that is necessary? What if a person never learned the word "killed", yet said "Help they are killing me!"

[joo]

Learning is RP indicating that the character is focusing on learning the language, e.g. establishing the meanings of words and expressions with another character who speaks the language fluently.

And how much of that is necessary? What if a person never learned the word "killed", yet said "Help they are killing me!"

2 years of it is neccesary, as the rule states. Due to the fact that Cantr is somewhat slow-paced, it simply wouldn't be practical to RP learning every nuance of the language - that can be interpolated based on the time spent learning and the intensity with which the character seeks or receives knowledge.

[Snake_byte]

Myself knowing two languages can RP being bilingual but not if my Charrie hasn't had a chance to learn it. If I legitimately come across a french note I can then RP deciphering the note and learning the language. AT THAT POINT ...
As long as knowledge of such is come across legitimately and IG.

2 years of it is neccesary, as the rule states. Due to the fact that Cantr is somewhat slow-paced, it simply wouldn't be practical to RP learning every nuance of the language - that can be interpolated based on the time spent learning and the intensity with which the character seeks or receives knowledge.

So 40 days then?

[chase02]

If this were honestly being considered as a poll to change things (which I don't think it is), I'd go for Option 1. I think 15 characters, each with their own language, is more than flexible. It rules out most of the current problems, as well. If you happen to run into someone speaking another language and they hand you a dictionary, so you can say 'wood' in polish, then fair enough, anything else should be against the rules, IMHO.

[Rebma]

If this were honestly being considered as a poll to change things (which I don't think it is), I'd go for Option 1. I think 15 characters, each with their own language, is more than flexible. It rules out most of the current problems, as well. If you happen to run into someone speaking another language and they hand you a dictionary, so you can say 'wood' in polish, then fair enough, anything else should be against the rules, IMHO.

Isn't that option 4

And no, it's not being considered serious, since a rule already exists, I would think. Now watch as another language topic is derailed by people saying they shoulda separated language groups from day 1 to avoid this.

[chase02]

Isn't that option 4

Actually, no. I was just suggesting they could use a word or two if they were presented with a dictionary. They still couldn't "learn to be bilingual". They'd still need to use their assigned language after that interaction.

[Doug R.]

As much as jaxon irritates me, given the viral expansion of problem language speakers that we've seen recently, I have to agree with him that the current system is a problem. Since events are only stored for 7 days, we simply cannot prove point #4 or the current guidelines. The spawning cannot be stopped, and enforcing the current guideline only punishes players that are not savvy enough to keep from getting reported.

The fact is, bilingual players will always have an advantage over their single language peers, no matter what rules are in place.

Point 2 is the easiest, as it needs no proof or enforcement.

Point 3 can be researched by viewing a character's travel history, but is still not entirely reliable.

The RP learning the language rule is an arbitrary rule of unknown intent and origin. What is it's purpose? Realism? All characters spawn knowing one language already, so how is it a stretch to know more? Fairness? There's innate unfairness apparent right from the start, since bilinguals are the only ones that have any hope of having a character speak both languages anyway (unless the player is a genius at learning languages). It just seems an arbitrary handicap imposed to make the rest of us monolingual folks feel better, and I'm all for changing the rules to something practical.

However, until such a change is adopted and announced, the current rule is still in effect, and will be enforced, where possible.

[Voltenion]

In Cantr, the characters have the limits we have. So, if a player is bilingual why shouldn't he RP learning a language? Really, it's not the bilinguals fault the others never learned anything else.
Do we impose rules on people who are just more intelligent and have better cantrian politicians? No, because it's our fault they are better than us. I know I stretched that example a little bit but my point is. I know Portuguese and English, why should other people be jealous about it? It is not my fault! I'm not jealous about Piscator because he can speak German. In fact, I'm doing something about it that is learning German in school. We should be happy because other people can play something interesting even though we can't and just do the best we can with the knowledge we have.

So, I agree with the current rule and disagree with all the rest.

[Gran]

What's that thing called "viral expansion of problem language speakers". They speak problem, about problem, are a problem? What is the problem?

[Piscator]

The problem is that having foreign language speakers in your town more and more becomes the norm, rather than an exception. While I usually like meeting foreigners, it can get a bit annoying having to cope with them from the beginning. Especially new players can be put off when their first impression of the game is someone speaking in a language they don't understand. There's also the problem of frequent breaching of the rules, which is another reason why it would be favourable that only prepared characters come in touch with other languages.

Curiously this only seems to have become a problem though, since the English areas have become infected.

[Josephpowers]

I personally don't see a problem with everyone mixing together. It makes the game more interesting.. and realistic.