Item modifications done by expert characters.

[Cogliostro]

What if in leu of a complex "carpetbombing" approach of a game-wide item quality system, we went about it another way. By simply gradually adding different kinds of projects into the existing game, of the following general form:

Project "Modifying Crossbow - Heavy Crossbow Mod"
Required items: 1 crossbow, workbench on location
Resources: 450g steel, 100g rubber,
Time: 3 days

The result is a new object : crossbow (heavy mod). All such (mod) objects are variations on the basic crossbow, with the heavy mod being (for example) twice as heavy to carry and with slightly higher skill-weighting, but in exchange could hit a bit heavier than a normal crossbow.

The way we imagine this, only expert characters, expert in the used skill, should be able to carry out the modifications. You travel the land to seek out an expert smith, because you dream of an elegant "steel battle axe (balanced mod)", which has the advantage that you need less strength to use it effectively.

In case I'm still not explaining clearly, this is all VERY similar to how you currently take a sabre and make a diamond encrusted sabre out of it, with the addition that only experts (or Masters, like we discussed before) can make mods. Hopefully, it needs almost no new programming! (skill check)

[Idriveayugo]

The only way I would be in favor of making additional mods to weapons is by making existing weapons less powerful and having the new weapons be at most as powerful as a crossbow....

OR

If we added ways for people to defend themselves, such as helmets, or body armor.

[Doug R.]

Yes. I think it's been pretty much agreed at the highest level that the current max damage (60) is going to be the game max. New means of protection don't help newspawns or poor characters at all, and we need to get away from making the game easier for older players.

[Caesar]

Yes. I think it's been pretty much agreed at the highest level that the current max damage (60) is going to be the game max. New means of protection don't help newspawns or poor characters at all, and we need to get away from making the game easier for older players.

Actually I do think you should try and implement things like armor.. But you shouldn't make the weapons even stronger.

Besides that every piece of clothing should have, however small, a protection value.

[Surly]

Yes. I think it's been pretty much agreed at the highest level that the current max damage (60) is going to be the game max. New means of protection don't help newspawns or poor characters at all, and we need to get away from making the game easier for older players.

One, I assume you mean older characters rather than players. Two, why shouldn't the game be easier for (successful) older characters?

Having said that, 60 should definitely be the maximum and I am not keen on anything with the word "mod" (sic) in it.

[Doug R.]

Yes, I meant characters. If the game gets easier and easier as your characters age and amass wealth (which it does), it becomes more and more boring. Older characters still need challenges (not boring ones like repairs, or transient tech-based ones like building the next big thing). Right now, there is a decreasing challenge curve as you age. It should be flat. Adding things that increase the slope any further should be discouraged.

[Cogliostro]

How does slightly increased weapon damage make the game easier and easier for older characters? Or even more strangely, how does having more usable variety in weapons make the game boring?

(unusable variety is what we've got now - where everyone carries the same 2-3 weapon types because they are the best, the rest of the weapon list is ignored by most everyone)

[Doug R.]

(unusable variety is what we've got now - where everyone carries the same 2-3 weapon types because they are the best, the rest of the weapon list is ignored by most everyone)

The choice right now is either a crossbow or battle axe. I agree that the weapons system sucks, but that's the fault of the technology tree. It's not that lesser weapons should have expanded usability, it's that they should be honestly easier to make. They got it right in the kite shield - it's much harder to make than an iron shield (and nearly got it right with the crossbow). If each weapon, say, at each 5% damage, had some small, extra building requirements, possibly using a wide variety of resources, suddenly making a battle axe would be very time consuming, making lesser weapons more attractive.

[Idriveayugo]

I agree Doug. It is the fault of the tech tree. It's pretty ridiculous that it doesn't take much to make the 2nd most powerful weapon in the game.

I also think though, that we could add further branches to the tech tree to make the game more interesting for older players.

It's really all about balance. It shouldn't be fair that a newspawn can move up at the top of the fighting tech tree with as little as a steel scutum or kite shield and a claymore/battle axe/crossbow, but it also wouldn't be fair if a tyrant who is 60 years old or so became nearly indestructible with upgrades and thus could not be removed from power.

One solution?

Maybe make a person who has full body armor on become more tired from doing projects (6%?) so that it's impractical for the person to wear the armor all the time unless engaging in fully armed combat.

Another solution?

Perhaps make people have to build arrows for moded ranged weapons, but become less tired after attacking with it than with a hand to hand weapon. Also, make people become more tired when attacking with a moded hand to hand weapon.

There are limitless possibilities to improve the tech tree. These are just a couple, but really the sky is the limit.