Re: Spanish

[Lyd]

In light of the discussion posted here:

http://www.cantr.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... ht=spanish

I keep wishing there was a clearly worded protocol posted to help those of us who would like to spawn a character in a language area different from our first language. One that clearly states what is considered CRB and what is allowed. Something that would be posted in an obvious place like the Wiki for those of us who have not shifted through the miles and piles of forums or have limited time to do so.

I was unaware that the use of a translator (mass media or person) was frowned upon or not allowed when I created my first character in a different language area. I am wondering if there are others like me.

I would not have attempted spawning a character in another language if I had not been comforted by the thought of having outside support. I am glad that I was blissfully ignorant…because I have learned much…in vocabulary… just by playing the game.

[frenchfisher]

I agree. I've often considered creating a character in the Spanish zone, but I'm afraid I would have to look up how to say "asparagus" or "spinach" and thus have the evil CRB demons after me.

[Chris]

I agree. I've often considered creating a character in the Spanish zone, but I'm afraid I would have to look up how to say "asparagus" or "spinach" and thus have the evil CRB demons after me.

Why is that? It's a CRB if you play an English speaker who knows a second language IG without any visible means. But if you play a Spanish speaker in a Spanish zone, then it would be fine to supplement your OOC limited Spanish with a Spanish dictionary. It isn't OK for that Spanish character to know English or any other language (unless the character learns the second language IG).

[sanchez]

You should not spawn a char in a language zone in which you have no knowledge, because it isn't fair to other players who have to communicate with it. But if you are sincerely trying to practise the language by playing in it, of course you should have access to dictionaries, etc. for speaking with spawned chars in the langauge they are supposed to be fluent in. I see obviously non-native chars in the English Zone frequently, and I applaud people for trying. But if you cannot communicate at all in some langauge, it's only disruptive to spawn there.

This is not the same thing as visiting another zone in game, and trying to learn a second language that your char did not spawn with. In that case, you need to rp at least some language learning process in game, even if you happen to be good at it ooc. Your char can learn faster, and of course you can emote fluently in any language, but do consider that monolingual players will be at a disadvantage in the same situation, and make a sincere effort. I don't know how the 3 cantr years rule was arrived at, but it seems fair enough to at least pretend in-game learning for that period.

How is this not clear from the other thread, Lydia?

[rconley]

How is this not clear from the other thread, Lydia?

Well let's see, I dont' think she asked a question. I think she only stated that she wished it was clearly posted somewhere and was not aware of it, not asking for clarification....

[Lyd]

Yes...it needs to be clearly stated in writing when one goes to make a new charry in another language zone. It was not clear when I did so. I must say the assumption that I purposely spawned a charry in the Spanish zone to be annoying to other characters is a little petty...I would have expected more coming from you, Sanchez.

[sanchez]

You've totally misunderstood my post. I thought you were asking a question, that had gone unanswered.

[rconley]

You've totally misunderstood my post. I thought you were asking a question, that had gone unanswered.

The misunderstanding seems to be on your part since no question was asked.

[Lyd]

Well, perhaps, my question was not clear enough. In the second paragraph I ask if anyone else had had the same experience. I merely wish to clarify this for others who come through the front door and may not have read the forums yet.

[sanchez]

Maybe it wasn't clear. If you speak some Spanish and would like to practise it, but occasionally need help from a dictionary, you should spawn a Spanish char. If you have never heard Polish in your life and expect to communicate using Babelfish, that's disruptive to native speakers.

I like learning in Cantr, but I have no fluency, so I would not spawn outside of EZ.

[rconley]

Oh you were very clear in your clarification...again. It just wasn't what was being asked.
Now back to Lyd's point...if anyone has something to add.

I am wondering if there are others like me.

She was curious if others have run across the same issue. I'm curoius about it myself.

[Sunni Daez]

Umm I had always understood it to be, if you spawn a charri in a language... then that is the only language the charri knows... regaurdless of what you know.. Discouraging people from starting charris in a different zone is just plain .. well, i lack the words I wish to use.. but don't do that.. The use of a dictionary is good.. but I suggest, if you are trying to learn the language.. you take your time and use a couple translators.. and translate if from english to spanish then back to english to ensure you get it right..

I have encounter those I know are not english speakers and I in no way find it disruptive... I look at it as an opertunity to assist someone in learning to speak.. Gah.. you know.. think about it.. is everyone you meet very adept in speaking their own language? They all gots the goodest of grammer and all huh?

Lyd... Enjoy and have fun.. thats what this game is meant for .... It ~is~ a game after all... PRACTICE away!!!

[Lyd]

Hehe.. I will work more harder on it...

[Pilot]

I think this thread should go in Suggestions, cause it's important to guide all players about the matter.

I have some experience in learning other languages in game and yes, I do use dictionaries from time to time to help myself. I don't see it wrong because if you don't learn by yourself and trust entirely on any translator you won't get far. Anyway, accents in different languages vary and no translator can help with it.

Perhaps an entry on the wiki explaining all this would be nice

[sanchez]

I would never discourage anyone from spawning a char to sincerely learn a language. I think it's the best part of Cantr, frankly. However, please be respectful of the fact that native speakers take their own chars seriously. You should not spawn a char in a language you don't have any chance of communicating in or for which you intend only to use artificial translation. That seems disrespectful, and disruptive.
This is from the login page:

Although some experience in a language is needed before one can play in that language group, the game can be used very well to practice your language skills in a second language. Just play one or two characters in a non-native language and you`ll be surrounded by people talking the language you are learning. Or you can play a character and so once in a while take a step back and observe what kind of societies you see forming, which can be very educational.