Religion

[Antichrist_Online]

Pie, simple point, the bible is a propaganda book that's been edited, rewritten and changed hundreds of times. (If not, why is there only four of the 50+ gospels in it?) Besides, Jesus wasn't the only Messiah/Miracle worker, there were hundreds and the myths about them got added to the Jesus myth. Mythras for example, had pretty much the same story. Christianity got lucky, doesn't mean it's right.

[Pie]

were there any writings about mythras? And if there are, how long was it from the time of it actually happening, to the time of the writing?

I'm really curious about all of these other gospels. link?

Oh, and the reason that they aren't in the bible, is probably becaus it has talking giant crosses in them. *shrugs* just a thought.

And as for the bible being rewritten, Sure, it has. This bible I have right in my hand has been rewritten by the church. So, I'm going to use the one in the museum that was made by constantanople, or the ones that were written by mathew mark luke jhon or paul or peter. I'm sure that those weren't rewritten. (becaus they were made before the catholic church gained it's power.)

[Nakranoth]

Alright Pie... I'm about to give you six statements... I want you to tell me which ones, if any are false according to you and according to Christianity.

1)Anything an infallible entity does is perfect.
2)Nothing that is entirely Good can want Evil.

3)God is infallible.
4)God created everything else.
5)God is entirely Good.
6)Evil exists.

And between free will and true bliss, I'd definitely take bliss, without hesitation.

[Elros]

God did not "create" Evil. He gave us humans, and the angels(Lucifer included) a free will. When we(Adam) and the angels(Lucifer and the ones that followed him) sinned, by breaking the Good, and Righteous commandments that God had made, then Sin and Evil began. Lucifer was the first to sin, and then Adam and Eve. So in that perspective, they are the ones that "created" evil. It isn't really considered creating though since it is just a moral position, and not an actual object. With that said, all God ever created was perfect and righteous with no evil. It was humans and Lucifer that brought any evil that exists into our universe.

[west]

As a new Atheist I can now say yes, fair enough, Atheism is -not- a religion. Hell, I'd proabably be mildly, though only mildly as I really care very little any more, offended if anyone said I belong to a religion because I'm an atheist.

I'm an atheist who's in a religion, but the religion ain't atheism and atheism ain't the religion.

[kinvoya]

That bunny sure is cute. It looks like it would be really soft if you petted it.

[west]

I agree. More bunnies necessary.

[Nakranoth]

Glad I could be of service...

But anyway, Elros... I invite you to the same thing I did Pie... tell me true or false to each of those statements... I'd really like to see what other people think on the matter.

[Pie]

1: yes.
2: yes.
3: yes.
4: yes.
5: yes.
6: yes.

He created evil when he created free will. He dosen't -WANT- us to be evil, but he lets us choos. Becaus if we didn't have free will, then what we felt for him, wouldn't be actuall love, now would it? It would just be... well, you get my point.

And again, I will say that, he probably knows a lot more than you do. He probably knows what will happen if he grants us all our every wish, so he decided that he wouldn't grant us our every wish. He made evil, so that he could se if we really loved him.

And I also have to say, does it really matter? All of these questions are "Hypothetical", or "If he really does exist" questions. If he really does exist, then it dosen't matter if I think that the fact that he created evil to test us is a good or bad thing, becaus nomater what, he's our best choice, not to mention the only choise were we actually get something good out of it.

[formerly known as hf]

God did not "create" Evil. He gave us humans, and the angels(Lucifer included) a free will. When we(Adam) and the angels(Lucifer and the ones that followed him) sinned, by breaking the Good, and Righteous commandments that God had made, then Sin and Evil began. Lucifer was the first to sin, and then Adam and Eve. So in that perspective, they are the ones that "created" evil. It isn't really considered creating though since it is just a moral position, and not an actual object. With that said, all God ever created was perfect and righteous with no evil. It was humans and Lucifer that brought any evil that exists into our universe.

Humans and Lucifer brought evil into our world?

But God is omnipotent?
So God could have stopped this creation of evil?

God did not.
If God was purely Good, he would abhor all forms of evil, and stop all forms of evil.

So, multiple choice answers people:
(a) God is not pure good. He allows evil.
(b) God is not all-powerful, Lucifer and humans created evil against his will.
(c) Arguments for God's existence are always circular and full of holes. As either God's ways are beyond our comprehension, and people would be better off just accepting that their faith is in something they can't undertsand or proove, or;
(d) God does not exist

QED Bitchiz

[Dee]

If God does not exist, then please explain the following to me:

1) How did you come into this world?

2) Who controls the wind?

3) How were plants created?

4) Who controls volcanoes and natural disasters?

5) Who made the Earth?

6) Who created the incredible human's mind?

7) Your soul, how was it created? You can clone a human being, but you can't create a soul.

There are many questions to be asked. I will ask them later.

[Antichrist_Online]

1) Random chance cause an egg and a sperm to meet, followed by doctors saving my life several times when I nearly died of natural causes, god has the least to do with my life. (Though the surgeon's nickname was "God").

2) The wind is controlled by convection caused by the sun heating different places by different ammounts causing the air to move.

3) Plants were created when chloroplasts evolved from a photosensitive micro-organism

4) Volcanoes and Natural Disasters are controlled by various factors including pressure weaking, moving tectonic plates and convection both in air and mantle.

5) Entropy. The random movement, causing gravity to pull the particles together. Given sufficient time a planet we call Earth formed round a second generation star (the sun has gone supernova once already).

6) Evolution, time and the connection between neurones, thus causing a complex system of electrical signals to form, which creates the illusion of conciousness in humans, a simple organ which developed to help us hunt more efficiently.

7) There is no soul. It's just a fairy tale told to make people feel better about themselves. Human cloning hasn't happened.

[Dee]

1) Yes, but who created your parents, and your parents' parents, and your parents' parents' parents, etc. etc. (you get the idea)? Who created Adam and Eve?

2) What causes the sun to heat in different places? Why?

3) Who created the photosensitive micro-organisms?

4) What makes the pressure go up and down and what causes tectonice plates (whatever that is) to move?

5) Don't even get me started on that one.

6) And that too. I don't believe in Evolution.

7) There is soul, it's not a fairy tale. Human cloning hasn't happened but there's the chance that it would happen soon. It's just not allowed.
If there isn't a soul, then how could people whose hearts stop for a few minutes still be able to stay alive? And what about those people whose organs are not working, but are living off on machines? (Like my sister, for example) Those people, and people in genereal, do not die unless their soul is gone.

[Elros]

1) Random chance cause an egg and a sperm to meet, followed by doctors saving my life several times when I nearly died of natural causes, god has the least to do with my life. (Though the surgeon's nickname was "God").

2) The wind is controlled by convection caused by the sun heating different places by different ammounts causing the air to move.

3) Plants were created when chloroplasts evolved from a photosensitive micro-organism

4) Volcanoes and Natural Disasters are controlled by various factors including pressure weaking, moving tectonic plates and convection both in air and mantle.

5) Entropy. The random movement, causing gravity to pull the particles together. Given sufficient time a planet we call Earth formed round a second generation star (the sun has gone supernova once already).

6) Evolution, time and the connection between neurones, thus causing a complex system of electrical signals to form, which creates the illusion of conciousness in humans, a simple organ which developed to help us hunt more efficiently.

7) There is no soul. It's just a fairy tale told to make people feel better about themselves. Human cloning hasn't happened.

Ha! It takes more faith to believe this then it does to believe the truth(God).

[the_antisocial_hermit]

Not really, Elros. It doesn't take any faith at all. Just science.

Just the same old arguments, over and over. They've probably all been repeated 500 times in the mere 104 pages of this thread.