Is profanity allowed?

[Jos Elkink]

I don't remember a ban per se, but I think it was agreed that role play can not occur in those situations where it is not reciprocated, if that makes sense.

Ah, ok, yes, that is probably the ruling. Sounds fair enough to me anyway ... Especially with the privacy clause Chris pointed out.

[Dreamhand]

I occurs to me that the nature of this (IMHO) very important thread comes down to this:

(A) Is Cantr a closed system, a group of consensual individuals who have gathered in a sophisticated PRIVATE setting to explore and interact and enjoy the experience of role-playing?

(B) Is Cantr an on-line PUBLIC business, open to anyone and with a responsibility to preserving a safe positive and legal environment for the general public?

When I joined up for this amazing game, I submitted a request to join. I assume that request was screened in some way and I received an acceptance. This seemed like a very sophisticated process, allowing the creators/moderators of the game to exert some control over who has access the to game... AND the culture that is fostered within it. Kind of like an "enter freely and of your own will" type of thing.

That leads me to believe that Cantr is a kind of closed system. You can join us and are free to participate in anyway you choose to. If your choices are offensive to the plays then either (A) You'll move your character to another space in the game where it ISN'T offensive, or (B) you'll continue to offend and the moderators will step in and... well... moderate the situation.

In THAT scenario, cursing, rape, sex and other role-played events are at the players discretion. If an in-game community doesn't want people doing those things, then warn the offender, then drag them to a jail. If they're unrepentant, then let them starve to death. Or throw food at them and let them rot. Whatever. The point is it's resolved in game and in character.

IF, on the other hand, Jos and company are trying to create a PUBLIC game event open to all, then they are accepting some responsibility for the content. AND the players are also accepting responsibility. That's where Terms of Service get defined and are agreed to. If this IS a public game, then the creators/administrators of the game become liable for its content AND vulnerable to legal action based upon it.

I love this game. I love the "hands-off" "forge your destiny with your own hands" "You're on your own" aspect of the game. I think that's one of the defining elements of its appeal.

But it's not my game. There are a lot of very gifted people who have invested massive amounts of time and creativity into crafting Cantr. As player's, we've contributed our own creative investment, but we aren't the one's who are exposed to pedophile/pornography/decency actions initiated by an outraged parent.

What IS Cantr? What to the creators WANT it to be? I'm grateful for the opportunity to express my opinion, but it's not my decision to make... 'cause I'm not the one who may need a lawyer.

[SekoETC]

Well, I don't know about you but on my character list it says "Male" or "Female" for every character. Which means they have some physical features that separate them. Scientifically the difference is determined by wether the person has ovaries or testicles, but since Cantrians cannot scan inside a person's stomach, I assume there are more external differences, which are similar to those in humans, since it has been said that Cantrians are humans. So all my males have a PENIS and all my women have a VAGINA. Some of them also have a need to perform sexual intercourse with members of the opposite sex (or in some case, with members of the same sex). So I do not think that FUCKING is OOC at all. It's a natural need that follows having distinct genders.

Also people are expected to tell their age upon joining, and people can check from the PD if someone they're planning to have sex with is of age or not. But naturally some people lie. And if they do, their parents should not start whining about "my baby getting molested by someone in writing" because the player has made a choice to pretend to be an adult and must thus carry the consequences as an adult.

[deadboy]

I say profanities are acceptable in cantr as without them it takes away from the RP experiance. It kind of ruins an event if you shout

"You attacked me you mean person!"

rather than

"You attacked me you bastard!"

Profanities are a way of expressing extreme emotions, and are therefore fine, and some may choose not to only use it for extreme emotions but to do it all the time, also fine, as that is very real, there are people in real life that do it to.

And about rape and sex, I agree with what you guys have all been saying

[Missy]

"how do we know cantrains have manhoods or women have kitties? "




And that argument has been time and time again, shot down. If they don't have t hem then why would they be male and female, "PERSONS." Or a woman in her twenties, if they didn't. I hate that, yes I'm going to swear, F*****G argument. It's stupid and I wish people would shut the *Bleep* up about "not knowing whether they have them or not." Look, it says in the rules, no mystical creatures. If it says that, and this is a woman in her twenties, then thats what the hell she is. She doesn't look like a plastic version of the matel Barbie or Ken. She's a woman and thus has boobs and a "kitty" But if there can't be mystical creatures, then these characters have to be woman and male and thus parts. Aliens might be a character that concealed their sex, but we as people and non mystical creatures---DONT.

You can sit and debate all you want about why you think they do or don't, but the answers are right in front of you and if you can't see them then perhaps you should be playing some game that strictly says, "Only mystical creatures are allowed, no playing humans." How much more does it have to be spelled out.

[Jos Elkink]

I don't care as much as her, but I must say I totally agree with Missy ...

[Drakulya]

I see it as such... if I rape, pillage, plunder, and other wise cause massive mayhem, I don't want an admin jumping in and going, 'Thats not acceptable, time for your charrie to die" cause that would be a massive OOC influence. I'm not trying to insult our Programmers and Admins, but I think that Cantr is its own world... their rules, their laws, their way pretty much. Since I'm in marketing I see abit of who's coming into the game (so I can work with it and set up more ways and enhance those) and I have to admit, some of them are down right idiots. Children will play, take me for example. I started at 16 years of age, now I'm 17. I've had my charrie's curse and get furiously mad at the whole world, but I'm mature enough to know the difference. On the other hand, I had an idiot spawn in a mountain village I'm in, call himself poopy head, then take some eggs and stuff then run. <<<that wasn't mine btw.

Maturity is determined by those who play... of course we will get children who think they are the coolest thing ever, but at the same time we have the majority of actual devoted players wanting to RP to the fullest extent. So, basically what I'm saying... let charries cuss, let them rape, and let them murder entire villages, because on the other hand we can have charries who up hold chastity, fall in love, and fight off an invasion of their homeland.

[deadboy]

Maturity is determined by those who play... of course we will get children who think they are the coolest thing ever, but at the same time we have the majority of actual devoted players wanting to RP to the fullest extent. So, basically what I'm saying... let charries cuss, let them rape, and let them murder entire villages, because on the other hand we can have charries who up hold chastity, fall in love, and fight off an invasion of their homeland.

Don't forget those that slap the bejesus out of those that try to rape, cuss, or murder entire villages

[Drakulya]

That depends on which of my charries it happens to if someone hits one of my Charries, he'll fight them to the death, but the other ones may run Or, maybe one of my charries might be the one doing it ya never know... thats the wonder of Cantr. Its a world unto itself, and its reality is usually based upon reaction, the more accurate or detailed the reaction, the more realistic Cantr becomes....

any one else thinking Matrix?

[Sekar]

Everything in-game is OOC influenced somehow. We just have to determine what influenced things should be in the game, and what influenced things shouldn't.

[rklenseth]

Swearing should be allowed in game as long as it is in character and not taken to excessive lengths. Although it might be better to be original and make some of your own 'curses' in game.

[viktor]

censoring in a thread of which the topic is about swearing is redundant unless you wanna pout short formes like fffffffff each f=fuck, that being said
swearing in context of roleplay is not wrong or bad, a newspawn popping out of the ground and bursting out with "kiss my asses you motherfucking pricks fuckity fuck fuck some more fuck!" would be bad and any sensible in game society would execute that newspawn, and hence such a thing like that should be dealt with in game however that society would deal with it.
that being said every language has swears and it would be contradictory to the game to suddenly ban sections of a language such as profanity.
fuck (fornication under consent of king) isn't that the original meaning?
shit... (well that smells like dung, or that smells like shit) who cares which is used, dung and poop are both the non profane versions and thus shit as in 'horse shit' etc.... is it's own level etc...
ass... well we have horses and zebras but we do not have the animal referred to in the BIBLE as an ass"respect thy neighbours ass" however after ages the word ass no longer refers to an animal in the english language unless a person specifically explains they mean the animal
bitch... we do have dogs and i guess we can assume animals have both males and females but we can't see it and they don't see cantriians as male or female, just a 2 legged freak to bite
bastard, just about every cantriian male is a bastard, it would be rare and for so few to come ito the world as anything but a bastard.
damn, that's too weak to bother with

i know i mised a number of our lovely english profane words but this will hopefully put it to rest.
now if you wish to have a more highly educated wounding pompous char, you could use the dictionary and look for various non vulgar insults and so forth but w/e i think my point is made now lol

[the_antisocial_hermit]

[Marian]

Wow, didn't realize this would turn into such a heated discussion. People seem to generally agree, though, so that's good.

[Hagan]

WOW

If I would of known there was a whole thread started because of me I would of came out of the deer woods earlier.

Now let me say a few things if I may. I know this has taken on a debate about this, and if I was to debate I would be against Cursing etc. HOWEVER. I will keep my response to the debate to this

When My Characters hears someone curse I respond to them general as I do in real life. I say GENERAL because in real life I just ask them to stop or if I can understand why they would say that out of anger or pain I just ignore it. SOMETIMES though I would love to double up my fist and show them how much I dislike Cursing but in real life I control myself IN Cantr I dont always.

With that said let me explain why I reported this three times

The Character that this happen to is a cruel Mean one. In his life he has been cursed out many times and in many fights, so this character by far has heard more cursing than all the others together. My children are 10 and 7 and when they walk into the room I just scroll fast and go on. I have told them it is rude to read over someone shoulder so I am not that worried about them seeing one on the screen.

What I reported though was when I logged in and was checking on this character when I clicked on the Objects. ALL I saw was F*@# Y@# followed by my Characters name all Caps and it filled the screen, I scrolled down and it just kept going. I opened one and the contents of the note were the same as the title over and over and over again, so the notes and even the contents of the note was a bomb IF my 10 year old would of walked into the room there would of been no way he could of not read this. I do not feel as if this was an attempt at roleplaying this was in my concept a player who could not handle his character becoming a slave, So I felt it was OOC response to and IC problem. SO I reported it #1 and all the notes were removed. I did not know for sure which character in the room had done this, but I had an Idea so I drug that character into another room.

The next day I go in and check and the same note bomb is there in that room, so I know who did it. My first response was to just kill him since he is at 80+percent damaged already, but I thought twice quickly knowing that I would just be reacting OOC myself. I also know this is a newspawn so this player would have a 40 day wait before he could fill that spot. I have had to go through that when Animals killed one of my newspawns and I know it is pain to wait out the 40 days. I wished to not do this to the player themself, I just wanted them to learn this is not the way to play the game. SO I reported it #2 and once again all the notes are removed.

Then the next day I go in and there are again notes of the same title. Although this time there are only three of them which have been slide into an adjoining room. Now maybe I can be more stubborn than I should, but I took this as just being disrespectfull to not just me as a player but to the Admin that had removed the two bombs. So I reported it #3

So to sum it up. I do not like cursing, in real life or in Game but that was not my reason behind reporting. I felt these notes had nothing to do with any role playing, but OOC Anger.