Fun factor

[Elros]

Artificial system... like appointing newspawns a random last name of one of the charries that are already there? Maybe make it so the charrie has to check a box if they want to be able to have offspring pop up...

You are not "born" when you spawn. You are twenty years old. So you don't have kids.

[wichita]

There just isn't any convincing anymore. I have to build cars in Siom to get people to do the simplest of ******* tasks, and even when doing that, I can't seem to buy loyalty. No matter how much I say to someone that they are welcome there and that they're in a great city and that they'll be taken care of. If they need something to please come and speak with me, they all still feel like individuality is more important. And while I commend Ekivok on one hand, I hated how he immediately spawned and already had a problem with the way the government was, it wasn't like his political beliefs had developed over time. He spawned and right away began asking why Siom didn't hand out food to other cities and it made absolutely no sense to me. Especially when everyone who spends five minutes in Siom knows that food is OFTEN taken to neighboring cities for absolutely nothing! What happened to people spawning and wanting to know what they can do to help? You just dont see it anymore. What you see is people asking: "Where can I get an iron shield? Oh, and for the least amount of work possible, by the way." Everyone spawns with their own desire for power and it's disgusting. It's not anymore, about helping a place become the most powerful it's about individual desires. No matter how much I grow to accomodate peoples individual desires, it's of no benefit to Siom. For a while it seemed to work, but it's not working anymore.

My favorite paragraph out of that incredibly beautiful post. All of this complaint about the CRB of importing OOC cultural elements....but the incredible stubborness of the modern Western sense of individuality has been a nagging source of annoyance for me, ever since I saw the first newspawn to pop up out of the ground in Seatown Forest and immediately shout, "Screw you Alicia Reed! I will not let you take away my right to gather resources!" and be summarily "wrongfully imprisoned".

And I, for one, realize that we can't force cooperation. It has been tried, it failed, not because it wouldn't have worked, but because the players wouldn't let it work. Right or wrong, I don't know, but I don't have that luxury right now. I am my department are trying to get a few of these things worked out. As I posted in staff discussion today (or yesterday - it is hard to tell lately), we need to make it relatively easy to survive, but it needs to take a reasonable amount of work to thrive. We don't want it to be oppressive and snail paced, but if we remove all the work, we destroy the purpose of the game.

Hopefully I haven't contracdicted myself yet.

[Missy]

I should like to add, I've very recently given away 1100 grams of iron, 1100 grams of steel and all the rubber for a bicycle for approximately 7 days of work because I am so desperate to find help. This persons bicycle isn't even going to be used to directly help the community I live in. The character is going to use the bicycle to start a trading bussiness in the near-by town which will bring in more rubber to my town. Of course, they'll trade it with us. But every day I went out and asked if there was anybody who wanted something to do, and that I would pay them or work out some sort of deal for their effort---NOONE responded. And I can't do it all by myself....I just don't understand.

[Elros]

I should like to add, I've very recently given away 1100 grams of iron, 1100 grams of steel and all the rubber for a bicycle for approximately 7 days of work because I am so desperate to find help. This persons bicycle isn't even going to be used to directly help the community I live in. The character is going to use the bicycle to start a trading bussiness in the near-by town which will bring in more rubber to my town. Of course, they'll trade it with us. But every day I went out and asked if there was anybody who wanted something to do, and that I would pay them or work out some sort of deal for their effort---NOONE responded. And I can't do it all by myself....I just don't understand.

Where are you at? I will come work for you. Just Kidding.

[Kreed]

Hey, I'll work for you for 45 iron or 35 steel a day.

[The Sociologist]

It's not anymore, about helping a place become the most powerful it's about individual desires. No matter how much I grow to accomodate peoples individual desires, it's of no benefit to Siom.

Yes, that is due to the collapse of strategy play. Obviously, if the game now specializes in people whose sole interest is in psychological roleplay, then of course they have no interest in larger issues of power, clan or nation. But once again I must point out that this process of losing strategy players began at the time the skills and tiredness systems were introduced. People can read what Griogal wrote before leaving (founded Clan MacGregor), or 1959Apache (Jo Jo of Seatown Forest), etc, etc.

By the way, there have of course always been players who specialize in purely psychological roleplay at the individual level, and who tend by nature to be highly individualistic. But this was less noticable in the past because there were also strategically minded players around. It is the loss of the latter that has hurt the game so much.

Not only that, I see a lot of this: "Hi, I'm new here. Is there anyone looking for a crew mate?" "Hi. Do you know where the nearest source of wood is so I can build a long-boat?" (Can't you require large rope for those damn long-boats?) Sea travel, has taken a LOT away from what goes on on land. Period.

A very interesting insight, and I agree. The emphasis that GAC placed on sea exploration went way over the top and did a lot of damage. Not only that, but I keep spawning characters in truly hopeless places, one after the other. Aki, Burgeo, now Omaho or some such? If these are the initial experiences of newcomers to the game, small wonder they don't stick around.

Let's just keep it simple, forget all these extra little islands and halt spawning on them, reconcentrate everyone on the main islands, and also fix the skills and combat systems to strengthen the possibility of conflict and speed up the game. Not so very difficult, surely?

[viktor]

hmmmm, after reading above i had an idea,
since halting spawning on a wide range of lands could cause complete depopulation on them how about.... making the first 3 chars of any new account spawn on one of the original areas for that language group, i don't know about all the other language groups too well but in english that would make the 2 big english island the target for new people who spawn any of thier first 3 chars in english.
then after those 3 the rest are distributed by whatever means the current system does it. at least this prevents a person from starting up and finding themselves on an empty land looking at an explorer ship that left just before they spawned i've never experienced it but i heard of it aki and burgeo are from my limited experience on them, not very good for a first time player either, even some seasoned players hate popping up there but at least we been around and won't get scared off the game.

[formerly known as hf]

Cantr is far too comfortable for the older characters.
And far too difficult for the new characters.

Roleplaying games of this type breed individualism. It can't be helped - look at EVE and WoW, although there are some collaborations, most players are highly individualistic. Cantr will be no different unless cooperation is not only encouraged, but is a requirement.
I would support a move which makes the creation of some things only possible with multiple workers (but also reducing time of project) and to have resource collection increase exponentially with additional particpants.

More importantly, though, Cantr needs to be taken out of this damned comfort zone. Well established organisations are almost aimless currently. Any possible urge for more power is immediately dampened by the huge problems travel represents (even with radio), the dire state of the combat system, and the nigh impossibility of settling on uninhabited isalnds (not for want of trying).
New characters are screwed, as no one is offering employment, even if they want it. They hardly have a choice but to try and make it alone...

RP hasn't taken that much of a change - it has just adapted - the RP is now all warm, cosy and comfortable, like much of Cantr is.

The combat system also needs to be heavily overhauled. I don't even want to begin to make suggestions on that, as I feel a complete return to the drawing board is well overdue.

[Nakranoth]

What's wrong with Burgeo? My favorite char to RP is from Burgeo... Live your character's life, don't let your character live yours.

[viktor]

What's wrong with Burgeo? My favorite char to RP is from Burgeo... Live your character's life, don't let your character live yours.

i had a char on there a fould mouthed disgusting git named Jargus who got killed by animals, i was playing him. like i said, for new players who are creating accounts they should be on the nice easy old islands not referring to the rest of us
i also have a char on aki and i don't have a problem with that one either, my statement about aki and burgeo was about new players only, people who never played before and could get scared away by the challenge of popping up on those lands may present.

[Nakranoth]

Which is why I'm in favor of upping the initial (and suggested) spawn number to three... if one of your first three happens to spawn there... no biggie... but if you only one spawns there, then yes, I see the problem.

[Mykey]

It agree, a remarkable phrase

[N-Aldwitch]

I should like to add, I've very recently given away 1100 grams of iron, 1100 grams of steel and all the rubber for a bicycle for approximately 7 days of work because I am so desperate to find help. This persons bicycle isn't even going to be used to directly help the community I live in. The character is going to use the bicycle to start a trading bussiness in the near-by town which will bring in more rubber to my town. Of course, they'll trade it with us. But every day I went out and asked if there was anybody who wanted something to do, and that I would pay them or work out some sort of deal for their effort---NOONE responded. And I can't do it all by myself....I just don't understand.

O M G

I have had the same problem. My character is very young and (gender hidden) leads a certain town.. and (gender hidden) has certainly given out in excess of 10,000 grams of iron just to motivate people to trade and work, and 5,000 grams of steel..

[Kreed]

In the whats wrong with Cantr thread Mafia Salad said;

You can only build things in a set order with set resources. It makes the goals and methods of achieving those goals the same in so many town because there is only one way of doing things or one way is obviously more efficient. It certainly does a lot to encourage the monotony that slowly kills the game.

I do agree there. And you can only build items on the list. Unique items like those suggested in the 'Art, handicrafts, monuments, galleries' thread; http://www.cantr.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9131
and Dynamically named statues thread;
http://www.cantr.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7137
Would give characters the chance to create their own props instead of having to wait for PD to program them and then ending up with the same item as everyone else.

Creative originality is confined to behaviour and notes. And behavior is confined by the set of props we have availiable, (and our imagination).

I'd just like to be able to create an object out of any amount of any meterial and name it as I like.
Eg;
I use 100 grams of stone to make an object which I call "doorstop". Which is useless but for role play purposes.

[Sicofonte]

That would be perfect, that would put Cantr in top of every RP game, that would be really GREAT!...

Why then no one has done yet?

It's DIFFICULT!


In the real world we have the physical laws to evaluate the actions and creations of the humans (you can invent possible things). In a simulated environment something has to look after that "rules of what is possible", an that things are programed rules.

Of course it's not viable to set a form called "INVENT" where you put the name, requirements and attributes of your new creation. Anyone could invent a pickaxe that collects 100 kg of hematite per hour, or a fishing rod "BalrogSlayer".
An alternative could be to have a legion of volunteers absolutly IGunbiased with a really cute common sense checking each kind of invent the people could try... no, it's not a choice.

Any suggestion?