Maximum number of resource gatherers

[formerly known as hf]

That's kinda what I originally suggested... Have gram limits which replensish at a certain rate, and so can be sustainable if the level of extraction is below that...

I like this, bring on the forced extradition from large towns...

[julie2]

As for private businesses being stifled by previously un-needed town governance now talking control - who's to say that a private company couldn't take-over the governing of a town?

Why should a private Company need to take over the goverment just guaranrtee itself some gathering slots?

I don't want a totalitarial regime running every location. That's what I don't want. Never mind who runs the regime. I want other options to continue to be feasible. I want it to be possible for the Town to own and/or some of the land and for various otherpeople to own/manage the rest. Whilst all the fields, mines ,machines, houses etcetra effectively share a single location, that just isn't possible- not once you add the stipulation that only so many can gather resources in that single location.

[nitefyre]

I have glimpsed through the topics about the changes and read several of the more insightful posts. Mind you, there's a lot of information overload on my mind at this hour of the early morning that I may be repeating what other people have said, but then so take it as if I agree with you on that point.

First off, the change is an acceptable and necessary item for Cantr, in general. Whether you consider life easy or difficult, the way it already was, the fact remains that Cantr is and always will be a developing society simulator. This means new ideas and new concepts to tweak the game, to if not make it challenging, make it real, whilst still enjoyable enough to play. Part of what makes Cantr enjoyable, besides some of the very good (and not always so good) roleplaying, are some of the reasonable challenges. I do not think the current change is unreasonable, as even the programmers have expressed ways to overcome or bypass the newest updates (i.e. go to smaller towns where slots are more likely to be open [exploration/colonization?] or work for people who already own the resources.) A field day for carrot wealthy business owners that may be, but it will help form a necessary economy, not just a roleplayed one.

The necessity will drive the game forward, and give it a true, exisiting structure. It will call upon the current sociocultural and political elements to uphold the economy, whilst the economic aspect calls the need for the other two elements. This, therefore, opens up a more concerted effort (like factories in cities) to help open the techonology to the common cantrian. Now, with people actually seeking employment to keep themself fed, and those employers trading with the farming guilds (no reason why farmers shouldn't organize themselves to build a harvestor and make even more surplus of foods to eat themselves), there will be a true economy based on need. From my understanding of mankind, it has always progressed through need- and implementing it rather than roleplaying it, will give it a slight shove forward.

That is my general understanding of the concept. Perhaps the figures may need to be tweaked. If it is based on a factor, maybe half of the populace (total, indoors + outdoors, to provide for a margin of error favoring the complainers). If this has already been done and set, then okay, it's just one change. No single change (from steel-iron change, iron-hematite change, tiredness [okay, that one, nearly ], skills, etc) has crippled cantr so that it couldn't grow back, having been here for a while, I think I have the right to say that.

<b>
We just need to embrace the inconvenience in stride, and work with or around it. </b>

[DougBrown]

I absolutly HATE the maximum recource gatherors....Its Retarded...It Adds NOTHING to the game....why should the game become what the Techs want it to be? Why do we want it toi be a society simulator? Why not just leave it as it is, The Best MMORPG Online? I see Cantr heading in the wrong direction, too much sufistication, and less Role playing...


*Wanna hear more? Tune into the radio station, I'll be talking about it next time im on.

[Snake_byte]

*pouts* I still like the the combined idea of Seko and myself better...

[Nick]

I absolutly HATE the maximum recource gatherors....Its Retarded...It Adds NOTHING to the game....why should the game become what the Techs want it to be? Why do we want it toi be a society simulator? Why not just leave it as it is, The Best MMORPG Online? I see Cantr heading in the wrong direction, too much sufistication, and less Role playing...


*Wanna hear more? Tune into the radio station, I'll be talking about it next time im on.

Cantr is a friggin society simulator, moron. If the staff listened to posts like this I'd quickly quit this game.

[Sho]

It is my impression that Cantr was created as a society simulator. I'm a lot newer to Cantr than many of the people here, with less knowledge of the beginnings, and of course Jos knows better than anybody, but I read that Jos and his friends started the original Cantr, in Lego, more for the purpose of watching characters live their lives, and the society they formed do its stuff, than for the purpose of causing the characters they controlled to succeed, and thus succeed themselves, as their players.

That, I think, is the central difference between an MMORPG and a society simulator.
In a society simulator, you, the player, look in on the world. You watch the characters live their lives, unaware that they live in a world that is contructed by the programmers and the players. You play your character or characters not as extensions of yourself, but as independent beings who need to be told what they're supposed to do. You might root for your characters' success, but your characters' success is not necessarily yours, and vice versa; a death in style is as good as eternal fame and riches, as far as the player is concerned. That's why you can't use your OOC knowledge for the success of your characters; that would be an empty success.
In an MMORPG, the player is part of the world. You play your character (almost always restricted to one) as an extension of yourself. Your character exists as a vehicle for you to immerse yourself in another world. Your character's desires are your own. If your character does well, you win. If your character fails, it's your loss.

That's why playability is not always the most important thing. In an MMORPG, anything that makes the game more entertaining or easy to pick up is good. In Cantr, there are times when some playability must be sacrificed for greater gains in sophistication, to make it a better, more realistic society simulator.

[Nick]

Wow. Well put. This needs to be like, framed or something.

[west]

Seconded. I came for the power, I stayed for the society

[mordiken]

How can it simulate society when restrictions are constantly being thrown onto us? All of the recent changes are making the game less enjoyable. Take away repairing that will increase production and therefore trade because no one area has all the resources it needs. Each person can't carry more then a handfull of tools because of the unholy upkeep. If we could each gather a good set of tools we would spend less time gathering and more time trading. I just think that maybe some new goals should be put in instead. Something that would take 2 or 3 towns worth of resources and cooperation to complete. Rare resources that are in places only temporarily then spawn somewhere else for awhile. New exotic projects to complete or new islands to explore that people don't spawn on but can only get to by exploration and maybe not growing food but having some of those rare resources. Its late and im ranting time for some sleep.

[formerly known as hf]

I agree to an extent - Cantr is a society simulator - but it is also a game

the simulation only works because lots of people enjoy participating

Not all of them enjoy participating purely out of it being a 'society simulator' - for me it's a part of the experience, but not all.

If people stop enjoying Cantr as a game - then it will fail as a simulator because there will be no participants to keep the simulator running

Although, saying that, I personally think these resource changes are an interesting addition - but I wouldn;t say the same about skills...

[Nick]

Are you guys suggesting that Cantr should sell out? Come on...

[formerly known as hf]

No - just that to achieve a good society simulator, a compromise may need to be made at some point (not now - I don't think the recent changes are that bad) between a realistic society simulator and a game that attracts lots of players - as to get Cantr to work as a better society simulator, you need lots of people to join in.

It may be possible to satisfy both - a great society simulator which is also a great game - that's the challenege for Cantr I guess...

[Nick]

Yeah, let's add stores with a bunch of NPCs... have people born with "money", maybe some "basic tools", clothing.

And then people can pay to have premium accounts, and maybe buy steel with real money, to be transferred to their characters.

I hope you realise I'm being sarcastic.

[formerly known as hf]

You kinda, in a round-about way, echoed one of my points - that what makes a good game is down to the player playing that game.
Unfortunately, Cantr is not a 'good game' for people that like the above set-up, or even what generally might be considered a good game if you go by the current PS2 top ten...
What Cantr needs to avoid is becoming an unattractive game for even more people