You should allow people to invent in Cantr

[Pie]

i have read them.. and have found three main arguments. i might be rong.. and i might just not understand your point of vew.. so if i am rong, pleas, tell me what you are talking about.

as for there not being enough staff.... 1) Ink could be hard to find.. as to reduce the amount of invintions, and reduce the amount of staff needed.

and as fore staff actually needing to balanc this thing...2) this thing will balance itself. becous all of the powers of the world will be making countles invintions, and counters to those invintions, hence, balancing itself.

This makes it so out of character knowledge suddenly becomes vital to play cantr. Lets say I happen to know how to construct an inter-continental balistic missle, with a fully operation launching system, which the pd authorizes. The problem is, not all the players of cantr know how to make an ICBM. There, you are shot down, you cannot possibly get past that hurdle, that argument is based right at the heart of cantr.

NOW i understand what you were talking about.

more limitations, but still a basac idea. only sertain things can be invinted. Now, what i am talking about, is the same thing as "scientific point of 1800".

now, we all know that ICBM's wern'd made in 1800, or even the 19th sentury.
and such is my point. The programing department has a tree of invinting ready. NOW, an example would be this.

a crossbow. now, you can try to invint a laser gun of ov this.. but is a laser gun the next thing for the crosbow? NOOO. you have to invint the thing that comes after the crosbow. AND if you try and make a muskit two early, than the programing department wont exept it. so it isn't just OOC knowlage. If you use that knowlage two early, you will get shot down. If you use that OOC knowlage to get you a laser gun before the tree sais you can, you will get shot down.

SO!!! Make a tree, BUT YOU WILL HAVE TO GUES AT WHAT THE TREE SAIS NEXT!!! AND, you can make a muskit, but you can also make somthing that is in the time era of a muskit, BUT IT WOULD HAVE A DIFFERENT NAME, and such.

PIE SAVES THE DAY AGAIN.

[kabl00ey]

That will end in it'll be a game of historical hot-or-cold. Great.

"Is it....a 1832 Remington Flintlock Mark 4? No? Hmm....Is it....a 1830 Colt Longbarrel Type 332? No....hmmm...."

(names totally made up - I have no idea about that stuff )

SO!!! Make a tree, BUT YOU WILL HAVE TO GUES AT WHAT THE TREE SAIS NEXT!!! AND, you can make a muskit, but you can also make somthing that is in the time era of a muskit, BUT IT WOULD HAVE A DIFFERENT NAME, and such.

[Pie]

(edited for acadental double posting)

[Pie]

you have a point.

alright. back to squere one. THINKING. well..... a tree has many branches. and so should the choises for what you can invint.

if all of those colts.. and barrals, and such are within reasonable 10 years of the trees current branch.. than that tree shall grow many leavs, and bloom pretty little nukular boms.

basicly, the tree is a dateling. Such as... at 1600days, you may create any wepon (varifyd from the crosbow) that was created in the scientific era of 1800-1840, or somthing of the sort.

[TatteredShoeLace]

Cantr is not a recreation of daily life....otherwise we have men with bone shields riding motorcycles. Just let this topic die. Pie, did you ignore my proposition?

[Racetyme]

Finally someone has awknowledged that cantr isn't supposed to be just like real life, I love you laces! *sarcasm*

[The Industriallist]

as for there not being enough staff.... 1) Ink could be hard to find.. as to reduce the amount of invintions, and reduce the amount of staff needed.

So the most completely solid point is that this is a really really bad idea.
Reasons:
-If invention is useful, first ones to get ink will just spiral out of control in power. No one else anywhere near them will have a chance.
-If the game didn't die there, ink would become more available, neutralizing the effect you think it would have.
-You've underestimated the difficulty. I suspect 5 inventions per day would be plenty to swamp the RD, even if they didn't need any new programming. If they did...1 invention per week would be lucky. For all of cantr.
-It makes no sense to need ink for invention, when we can write endlessly on free notes with nothing.

Probably more I don't see.

Also, inventing would require copious OOC research to figure out what you wanted to invent. And proposals would just be a tremendous pain to the RD. Honestly, they'd be insane not to quit if something like this came in...

[KVZ]

Yes, you should allow, but this must be very good implemented.

[Pie]

(Edited for ACADENTAL post doubling. HEH!!! P.D.!!! POST DOUBLING!!!!

[Pie]

As i said before, this could.. actually, be compleatly automated.(i said it in a different thread)

You have sertain choices... for.. lets say.. a sabre. You could...

ok... First you need to select wich object you want to change. Lets say you choos a sabr.. and then you have these options.

1: Increas attack / defence.(it would be attack in this example.) You could increas attack by adding more iron to it, or any other way that the buttons tell you that you can.

2: add a figure. Such as.. the figure of a man, or animal, and then you will be able to choos what this figure will be made out of, and it's size. And you have sertain choises as to add the figure of a man, or animal, or just add a jewl. And... this is a hard one to implement. Maby there is some sistem to add animals into your coises.. such as.. a project... memorising animal.

3: change style. You could change the name of this sabre, and thats it. Since you don't really have discriptions for sabrs.. this is it.

And also, a limit. Such as, sabr's cant have a more powerfull attack than 50% or cars cant go faster than the speed or sound.. or somthing of the sort.

And, changing the name could make problems in a CR breach, such as, changing a crosbow into an inter planintary laser gun... that cant happen, so maby the third option is forfiet. you know... that one is debaitible.

[Sho]

Pie, you can delete your posts in this forum. Do that instead of blanking the doubled post and adding a silly comment.

This might be doable. The numbers would need to be carefully considered, but otherwise I think part 1 of Pie's suggestion is codable, since attributes are stored for individual objects, and would be good for Cantr.

Suggestion 2 and 3 basically fall under the engraving suggestion, which I think was accepted.

[Pie]

Actually... 3 would be.. like... changing the name of the object frome "Sabr" To "Inter planitary balistic misile." Changing what it is, really, not giving the sabr a name.

OOOO!! And, HIGM FRIGM MICKLE MICKDOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

[Thetaris]

I am abashed at the intentions of creating an inventing engine into the background of Cantr. It's a horrible idea, no offence, regardless of the posts and attention it's attracted.

1) Laser guns in Cantr? I don't think so.

2) And the ProgD would be being unrealistic to then ban Space Ships... So you'd have to allow things like that, even jets, which is stupidity on a pie. Yes. On a pie.

3) And as previously posted, the town with the ink would expand extraordinarily fast; "Okay, guys, that town that gave us grief before is going down" a man in his thirties says. He's holding a Sabre, which is pretty damn strong, and the rest are holding composite recurve bows and long bows. Wa-hey, they march into this town, and, "Oh god no, they have laser guns and missiles! RUN! TOO LATE, THEIR JETS ARE BOMBING US!"

4) How would you regulate inventions and emails? And who sets the rules for how far we can advance, and how long it takes?

5) How the HELL does ink make you suddenly turn a town from Bone-knife wielding fanatics to jet-pilots and machine-gun experts?

6) And if Ink is used to write notes for inventions, what magic resource is used to write normal notes? Shouldn't that be usable, what we normally use to make the notes? (Oh no, we have to go 5 towns away to get the RIGHT ink!!)

Now that I've had my bitch, let this topic die. PLEASE PIE!

[ornithopter]

Actually, I think it's an "inventing engine" is a very good idea. Your six points basically boil down to regulation, which, ignoring manpower issues temporarily, would be clearly be done by the Cantr staff, probably by some combination of the RD and PrD; interpretting Pie's overenthusiasm as serious suggestions*; and pointing out that ink, as has been stated previously, has many problems, and thus hasn't been pushed as a solution by anyone but Pie.

But since no one's managed to come up with a better system than the one we have currently, we'll stick with that.

Pie's next-to-most recent post, however, is really a seperate idea, and might have been better off in its own thread, instead of at the end of seven pages of unworkable suggestion and Pie's lunatic raving.

Cosmetic distinctions would be covered by the (approved?) engraving idea, but the only suggestions I've seen for qualitative differences have been based on skill levels (though it's worth noting that I've only been playing for about two months and didn't search the forum before posting this). Pie's first suggestion would allow lower quality items to be made for fewer resources, which is friendly to the poor, and if done carefully, the advantage gained by those able to pay the additional resources wouldn't be unbalancing.

I'd suggest that time be considered for use as a cost variable in addition to the physical resources. That would allow an expert to make an expert sword in the same amount of time it would take a novice to make a novice sword, and still allow them both to make average (skillful?) swords at the current speeds.


*Pie, if you weren't actually joking about laser guns and nukes, please just let me think you were.

[Lumin]

I just don't get topics like this.

Really, I don't see how an 'invention system' could be seen by anyone as even possible to implement, let alone desirable. Who's going to process and screen the requests that'll be pouring in? Who gets the final decision? And who's going to deal with the inevitable b****ing and complaining on the forums when something unbalancing slips through?

And ever hear of roleplay?

I've invented a bone spear before, and I've seen someone invent a bow stringer and longbow. That was pretty impressive, no one in town had ever thought or heard of anything like it before, but this guy was sharp. I remember he first was exasperated by the animal situation, and decided we really needed to make a more effective bow. Then a little later he came up with more definite plans and explained how it would be made. My char was pretty excited about the whole thing, and even though she wasn't quite bright enough to understand all the details about tensile strength and the like, she was glad to help with the simpler stuff.