Armor as Clothing ONLY

[bobbogum]

I don't doubt that this has been suggested before but I guess the search system hates me so, Why can't we have clothing that is described as armor, they have NO DEFENSE just for role playing. I would not care if it ever has any type of defense, I JUST WANT TO BE ABLE TO WEAR ARMOR.

For example:

Chain Maile Coif:
Intricately weaved loops of metal that are arranged to form a hat like piece of clothing it hangs down to just below the shoulders.
It takes 1000 grams of iron or steel and various tools to complete

I WILL REPEAT THIS IS FOR ROLE PLAYING PURPOSES ONLY

[Doug R.]

I think it would just confuse people if it doesn't actually do anything.

[Arenti]

I think it would just confuse people if it doesn't actually do anything.

Agreed. Especially new people and also others perhaps will think it is actually for defense and will certainly complain and find it stupid if they find out it doesn't actually do anything.

[Cdls]

I like the idea.


As for confusing people, are we not passed that stage already?

Eating raw onions to cure a nasty axe wound

The awkwardness of the battle system (am I the only one that get the image of 'Alright, everyone done? Okay, get back to work and we will do this again tomorrow'?)

Why are crowbars the only thing capable of breaking into buildings/through doors? (ie. sledghammers, battle axes ramming that car right into the building!)

I could go on, but you get the point. Cantr doesn't make sense, it is part of its 'fun' and this would add a nice RP element as well.

[bobbogum]

Maybe in the section of "clothing" where you can select to build them it says FOR ROLEPLAYING PURPOSES ONLY NO ACTUAL DEFENSE or something

[Piscator]

If some parts of the game make no sense, we should work on improving them, not use them as an excuse to implement more things of the same kind.

So, what, except that ProgD may not have the time for it, is keeping us from implementing armour that in fact has an effect?

[SekoETC]

I think the reason for not implementing armor in the past has not been that it would be difficult to do but that it would cause imbalance. IRL if you hit someone with a sledgehammer or another heavy weapon and they're wearing a chain mail, they might suffer broken ribs and will definitely get a bruise, while the purpose of the armor is to prevent cutting damage. Maybe armor would block only about 10-20 points of damage but would do it all the time (provided that it covers the body part that was hit) while shields would continue to block randomly. Armor as rp items could be implemented quickly but there should be clear plans about making it functional in the future. Also it should weigh something, and also while being worn. Then there's the issue of deterioration, it should deteriorate while taking a hit, but currently I think when you wear something, it deletes it from your inventory and adds it to the other table, and when you unwear it, it adds it into your inventory as a new item, so the stuff bound to the item wouldn't be stored anywhere. Although maybe I'm wrong and it just sets the location as negative, then sets it back to positive when disrobing - hopefully it does it like that.

[Piscator]

Well, if armor would just absorb a certain percentage of damage, we could probably avoid any major imbalances. You would be able to take more punishment, but you wouldn't become invincible all of a sudden. Tiredness generation could be increased by the same factor.

Having weight and a deterioration status would definitely be a good thing, but I don't think it would be absolutely necessary.

[Ryaga]

Here's my take on armour if it has actual use:

- Armour should block a percentage of damage each time.
- Armour should have different rating for different weapon types. (This would probably take a field in the items in the database or something.)
- Armour should increase your tiredness to the extreme on attacking. Heavier types
(a full suit platemail?) should look at your strength and even with much stronger than average it should nearly double your tiredness.


Also on the subject of making sure this doesn't make the elite even more elite. There should be plenty of low tier armour. Plate armour was only for the elite anyway and should be EXTREMELY hard to make.

I think it should go like this:

Hide Armour - Thick hide armour with multiple layers of hide that protects the wearer. Might soften the blow of a light blunt weapon. Cleaving weapons are nearly unnefected, and thrusting only slightly.

Fur Armour - Many layers of fur are sewn on top of one another. Slightly better than Hide armour.

Cloth Armour - Probably in the form of a gambeson or the likes. It'd be a heavily (I mean heavily and you'd be surprised by how much basically wearing a quilt can protect you even from knives and things.) padded gambeson and accompanying pieces.

Leather Armour - Thick layers of overlapping layer protect the wearer lightly from most weapons. A good thrust, or swing can still make it through or purely the impact of the swing can incapacitate the wearer.

Riveted Cloth Armour - Cloth armour riveted with small metal studs. Adds some additional slashing protection.

Riveted Leather Armour - Leather armour riveted with small metal studs. Also adds some additional slashing protection.

Ringed Cloth Armour - Cloth armour with large metal rings on it. Makes it moderately more protective of the wearer against slashing blows. Does not take anywhere near the metal needed to produce the more complex metal armours .

Ringed Leather Armour - Same as above, only this uses leather and it's advantages as the backing instead of cloth.

Scaled Cloth Armour - Similar to ringed armour but this uses scales that are sewn onto the cloth. Gives decent thrusting and slashing protection.

Scaled Leather Armour - Uses scales to protect the user. They are sewn onto a leather backing instead.

Chain mail - Great against slashing weapons. Not so hot against anything else. Pretty heavy, takes a long time to make and takes large amounts of metal to construct.

Scaled Chain mail (might have to check with history on this don't know if this one exists) -
Chain mail with scales riveted(?) on to it. Provides a bit more thrusting defense. Is even heavier than chain mail.

Plated Chain Mail - Chain mail with plate armour covering it where applicable. Head/Chest/Shoulders/Knees and such with chain mail exposed at the joints. EXTREMELY heavy. Is pretty great against anything but heavier slashing/blunt weapons. A good hit from a broadsword, halberd, or mace would do significant damage. A crossbow might be able to pierce the lighter points of the plate as well.


Okay done with my rant.
Chain mail and it's derivatives should make you like ridiculously tired.
Also if it's not put in with an actual implementation I'd LOVE to see it for just decoration.

[Doug R.]

An alternate way of implementing armor (and possibly the best way) is to do it like it works on animals. Armor has hit points which get taken off before yours. Once they're gone, the armor is destroyed. If armor wasn't repairable, it would make it disposable, increasing consumerism.

[Ryaga]

Think it should give an item like "Ruined Armour" which is then used in a project with more resources that it needed to make it in the first place to remake it.

So:

Bob uses Ruined Chain Mail on Fix Chain Mail.
Bob uses 100 small metal rings on Fix Chain Mail.

[AlchemicRaker]

An alternate way of implementing armor (and possibly the best way) is to do it like it works on animals. Armor has hit points which get taken off before yours. Once they're gone, the armor is destroyed. If armor wasn't repairable, it would make it disposable, increasing consumerism.

What if armor's rot doubled as hit points? I really like that idea, but it also makes sense that armor should be repairable.

Instead of making it absolute, though (like, armor takes all of the damage before you take any), make it take part of the damage (say... half), and give it a failure chance (like failing to block with a shield).

- Natso

[Piscator]

I'm with Natso there. Absolute protection would mean that armor would either crumble to dust after a few blows or make you an unvulnerable fighting machine, depending on how much "hit points" we assign to it. Splitting damage 50/50 between armor and health bar should be the very least.

[Ryaga]

Problem with that is:
If it's 50/50 all armour is the same with more or less deterioration rate.

[AlchemicRaker]

Well, the difference between armors is how fast they rot (the HP absorbed / rot caused) rate.

So like, leather armor would take a lot more rot when it absorbs damage, but iron armor would only take half as much rot (thus, while they both absorb 50% per attack, the iron armor absorbs TWICE AS MANY attacks before being destroyed).

That said, having the absorb % vary a little between armors wouldn't be too bad either.

- Natso