I'm afraid this comes close to driving me from the game...

[Jos Elkink]

And Jos saw this and was pleased.

And so it is!

[deadboy]

Nice one at fixing it Chris

[The Sociologist]

1) It should not be all that easy to live in a forest... hence we have no RL cities in forests...

My point was rather that the prepared food issue risks penalizing precisely those in-game cultures which actually try to build up large populations. The whole point of harvesters is large-scale production, yes? So you need large-scale cooking to match it.

2) There is nothing complicated about the stone quarry. There was an issue with the distribution of timber, that is all...

You must be joking. A hematite drill, which has a huge military and tech impact, requires 3 resources, 1 tool and 14 days. A stone quarry requires some amazingly complicated stuff about logs, an endless array of tools and 20 days to build. So some of you lot wanted stone quarries, some didn't and the result was....what you see. What I'm saying is I get irritated when we players have to suffer through stuff because of internal "politics" among staff.

3) Maybe if your character wasn't such a complete ass, people would be more willing to help you?

I'm not here to win popularity contests, neither are my charries...in theory. Unfortunately, treacle sticks.

[nitefyre]

Earlier:

The problem now however, is that these recent adjustments are penalizing the high-tech forest-based cultures. Potato salad just doesn't cut it in many areas, I'm afraid. There are certain people in the GAC, I think, who could do with a spanking. The bronze debacle deserved six of the best (does anyone know what that means anymore? Wink), followed by absurdly complicated "stone quarries" and now the total inability to understand that not everybody lives in Siom or Drojf when it comes to food needs (but again I'm not opposing the general idea).

Siom and Drojf are two locations where stone is an important local commodity...

You must be joking. A hematite drill, which has a huge military and tech impact, requires 3 resources, 1 tool and 14 days. A stone quarry requires some amazingly complicated stuff about logs, an endless array of tools and 20 days to build. So some of you lot wanted stone quarries, some didn't and the result was....what you see. What I'm saying is I get irritated when we players have to suffer through stuff because of internal "politics" among staff.

...which would only suffer by the extent of which stone quarries are difficult to build.

So on one hand, you're ranting about staff benefitting attention to Drojf and Siom, whereas other, you're arguing against make it hard for them to build stone quarries. It doesn't take a genius to see the contradiction here.

I've been running a forest (wood only) location since about 650, and to date, I haven't had food problems, because I have measures to (require, if not highly encourage) trade for and collect food with. Whatever happened to solving problems in characterly, and taking the challenges with stride? Any strategy player is familiar with the concept of contigency--not nagging and complaining for supernatural intervention. In case it would interest you, that wood only bearing location had not only one of the first vehicles on the island, but the very first functional motorvehicle, despite all its set-backs.

[Cookie]

I've been running a forest (wood only) location since about 650, and to date, I haven't had food problems, because I have measures to (require, if not highly encourage) trade for and collect food with. Whatever happened to solving problems in characterly, and taking the challenges with stride? Any strategy player is familiar with the concept of contigency--not nagging and complaining for supernatural intervention. In case it would interest you, that wood only bearing location had not only one of the first vehicles on the island, but the very first functional motorvehicle, despite all its set-backs.

To be fair I think the Sociologist has tried to solve the problem in character. But what with the resource gathering restrictions and the nearest source of food in the area, Akypor, it hasn't worked. Soon if problems like this aren't solved it will hapen in other areas. The best solution would be to get rid of gathering limits, I never agreed with that anyway. What fool came up with the idea that theirs not enough stone on a mountain that more than 8 people can't mine it for example.

[nitefyre]

Perhaps the mine shaft can only fit 8 people? Mountainous terrain is not the easiest to cross to begin with, let alone start mining. And usually in Cantr, there are many mountains to choose from in a specific area.

It is not like there have not been forced exodus in real life--from the Irish potatoe famine to the migrations of people to hang on to migrating animal patterns.

I think it's just half-assed to threaten quitting over it, although it's not the first time nor the last.... Personally, it could have been achieved without looming the "oh my goodness--everyone get dramatic because I'm quitting," which is being way over played on this forums.

[Cookie]

Don't get funny about it it's true. THeres a flipping mountain full of rock and there's only enough for eight people. Considering the scale of Cantr and it's population it would take milions of years for the resources to be used up at the rate it is being now.

This problem will occur in other places soon enough, it wont be compared to the irish potato famine then.

And I think the reason the sociologist threatened quiting was because of the time he puts into the particular chracter this famine is related to. I'm like him also in that if my favourite character died I would also quit (..and no, I aint telling you who my favourite character is).

[The Sociologist]

So on one hand, you're ranting about staff benefitting attention to Drojf and Siom, whereas other, you're arguing against make it hard for them to build stone quarries. It doesn't take a genius to see the contradiction here.

I don't know precisely how staff think. All I know is that some wanted quarries and others didn't. Yet others seemed to want new machines to involve rare exotic materials imported from other islands, and others didn't. So the net result of all this politicking was these bloody "logs". No sane person could possibly believe it takes more effort to make a "log" than an entire kitchen full of tables, chairs, pots and ovens. Same with bronze. Ruined by staff politics. This must stop.

Whatever happened to solving problems in characterly, and taking the challenges with stride? Any strategy player is familiar with the concept of contigency--not nagging and complaining for supernatural intervention.

1. Akypor has no slots to spare for digging stone.
2. The mountains do, but they are foodless.
3. Yes, we could have gotten potatoes to the mountains once.
4. Yes, we can still get potatoes to the mountains today if we can cook them in large enough bulk. But potato salad is not a solution, and I'm not prepared to risk the lives of so many charries on 40,000 grams of potatoes being transported from two towns away every ten days.
5. If the capability to cook machine-harvested food in large enough bulk is not made available, then sooner or later in an increasing number of areas the only solution will be to tell newcomers to the game to bugger off.
6. If that's what GAC wants, then fine.

(I again repeat that I do not oppose the resource limits; I do not oppose the new food values)

[nitefyre]

Considering the interest in Akypor's limestone, by a region we are both aware of, I am surprised therefore that food is not being shipped in from one of the big cities you mentioned...I think this could be a driving force for the necessity of more regionalized trade but that's just one solution. Then again, 8 slots seems kinda small from what I understand of the size of the town.

[The Sociologist]

Considering the interest in Akypor's limestone, by a region we are both aware of, I am surprised therefore that food is not being shipped in from one of the big cities you mentioned...I think this could be a driving force for the necessity of more regionalized trade but that's just one solution. Then again, 8 slots seems kinda small from what I understand of the size of the town.

There is no need to import limestone into Akypor since it now has two potato harvesters! That would be silly.

You see people, this is what I mean. Nitefire sees Akypor only from a KDS perspective. There is a similar thing with the GAC, as far as I can see. Forget that towns around Akypor actually have charries in them, and the charries live lives quite divorced from KDS politics.

As I see it, potato salad is a KDS plot!

EDIT: I meant to say "There is no need to import food into Akypor since it now has two potato harvesters! That would be silly.

[nitefyre]

No, I meant the exportation of limestone. I see it from a regional perspective, from Captain Hobbes' eyes, if anybody. I probably shouldn't discuss trade routes so openly on the forums, though. Then again, the only KDS character I play is a MacGregor

[Agar]

While I have always said that the food change steps two and three should have always been reversed, I have a seperate complaint. Harvester rates.

Before the change, you could gather 400 g/ day of carrots by hand, and use a harvester to haul up 1600g/ day. That's a factor of 4. After step one of the change, you can currently gather 630 g/ day of carrots by hand, and ... 1600g/ day with a harvester. That's barely a factor 2.5.

So ... untill the harvesters are scaled, not only is it making raw foods less desirable, it's making raw food harvesters obsolete.

[Phalynx]

Slaughter all newspawns, or have a few purges, or ship out some annoying characters to the mountains to dig stone under duress on half rations, its kinda in keeping with the philosophy of New Xanth after all.....




(edited because my keyboard has a mind of its own!)

[the_antisocial_hermit]

While I have always said that the food change steps two and three should have always been reversed, I have a seperate complaint. Harvester rates.

Before the change, you could gather 400 g/ day of carrots by hand, and use a harvester to haul up 1600g/ day. That's a factor of 4. After step one of the change, you can currently gather 630 g/ day of carrots by hand, and ... 1600g/ day with a harvester. That's barely a factor 2.5.

So ... untill the harvesters are scaled, not only is it making raw foods less desirable, it's making raw food harvesters obsolete.

I think they said somewhere on the forums that they're going to scale the harvestors after the food rates are done changing.

[The Sociologist]

Slaughter all newspawns, or have a few purges, or ship out some annoying characters to the mountains to dig stone under duress on half rations, its kinda in keeping with the philosophy of New Xanth after all.....

How can you say such a thing! Were you the Phalynx of Akypor?