Overhearing whispers, your opinion

[notsure]

Doesn't anyone just step out onto the road to have private discussions anymore?

[*Wiro]

Doesn't anyone just step out onto the road to have private discussions anymore?

I do, even had a gay picnic. Just hoping we get insta-return soon.

[Gran]

put a location limit

This was done 4 and a half hours before you posted.

Sorry, I'm used to cantrian dialogue. Actually, it is more because I expected a warning about the change in the game, and not was I very willing to skim through all the battlefield that this topic is into. Oh, and I didn't slept in 22 hours when posting, so yeah. Not a very elaborated post, gimme a break. *sighs*

My point was to do something to stop the effects of the implement, turns out the location limit worked. The thing may cool down to a normal level of annoyance to be discussed, as it diminished and the people are getting around.

In my opinion, the overhearing sort of backfired. As Piscator said, something critical may appear sometime, but the grand majority of the content shown will be erotic messages, trade messages and arguing. Not very interesting. And between actually seeing those uninteresting events and having a simple message, "X whispered to Y", the message would be preferrable to avoid the cluttering of the event page.

Isn't there a way to make overhearing a decision of the player? An option "to overhear"?

[Fieger]

Ok after few hours with implemented overhearing I'm still against it. To fill Wiro in I prepare small list of arguments why IMO this idea is so bad.

1. Not everyone is annoyed when hearing lot of whispering
2. Some players really want to keep some privacy and they don't care about going into building because it is time-consuming.
3. Other players dont care about what these whispering characters said
4. This implementation is forcing players to change their RP...and as far as I know people don't like to be forced to do anything..
5. As it was written many times before it was implemented to fast and without proper consultation.
6. I realized that polish players aspire to make big cities...at least four or five locations in polish islands are inhabited by more than 30 characters...with biggest Vlotryan - 175 characters. I read that you reduce chance of overhearing in such places...but I still think that is a bit unrealistic...in real in large cities you can't hear what someone have just told because of background noise...
7. And last one. Some people plays Cantr using low capacity networks...if they choose to go to house to talk or to write their message and pass it to somebody...hmm 1,2,3...about 8 or 9 clicks...when whisper use only 4 clicks...

[*Wiro]

Ok after few hours with implemented overhearing I'm still against it. To fill Wiro in I prepare small list of arguments why IMO this idea is so bad.

1. Not everyone is annoyed when hearing lot of whispering
2. Some players really want to keep some privacy and they don't care about going into building because it is time-consuming.
3. Other players dont care about what these whispering characters said
4. This implementation is forcing players to change their RP...and as far as I know people don't like to be forced to do anything..
5. As it was written many times before it was implemented to fast and without proper consultation.
6. I realized that polish players aspire to make big cities...at least four or five locations in polish islands are inhabited by more than 30 characters...with biggest Vlotryan - 175 characters. I read that you reduce chance of overhearing in such places...but I still think that is a bit unrealistic...in real in large cities you can't hear what someone have just told because of background noise...
7. And last one. Some people plays Cantr using low capacity networks...if they choose to go to house to talk or to write their message and pass it to somebody...hmm 1,2,3...about 8 or 9 clicks...when whisper use only 4 clicks...

1. Neither am I. I like having this suggestion more than having it not at all, though, because I think it allows for more RP.
2. That's really their own problem, it's not always about getting projects done. It's not that big of a deal to miss one project tick.
3. True, but that does not change the fact that the message is there. Whether overheard or not. I agree with being able to turn it off though, if people really think this is a problem.
4. Every suggestion does this. Does this mean no suggestions should be added anymore, then?
5. True.
6. And I am not sure what to think of this one. You would have more to overhear, but there would be more background noise. The chance to be overheard is already much lower now, though.
7. I honestly don't care about this, instead of whispering ten times (fourty clicks) they could write a note with everything on it and spend just eight clicks. That, and in the future there will be notes for people to read, which adds to the saving of the history of Cantr.

[the_antisocial_hermit]

If I'd had time to put in my 2 cents on the actual suggestion before it was implemented, I probably would have said I would prefer something similar to the original suggestion and/or the eavesdropping suggestion.

The original suggestion would cut back on the "so and so whispers to so and so".

The eavesdropping would require some actual effort on the part of someone to do, as well as could make people more paranoid about who might be trying to listen in. It would put both parties at risk of being discovered. And it would limit it to fewer people actually overhearing, which is more realistic (no matter how many/few people are in an area, not everyone will hear it- which if this current implementation were changed to where only a random person heard it, it'd be better). And if they try to eavesdrop, then they could have a better chance of hearing what's being said than as is currently.

There are going to be mistells any time people are whispering just naturally. I don't particularly think it should be a free and easy thing for everyone in a location to hear. There should be effort expended on both sides. Those that want to be secretive need to make sure they're being secretive. Those that want to listen need to make an effort to listen in on the people they're suspicious of.

I honestly don't care about this, instead of whispering ten times (fourty clicks) they could write a note with everything on it and spend just eight clicks. That, and in the future there will be notes for people to read, which adds to the saving of the history of Cantr.

Just saw this bit of your post. Interactive dialogue is more interesting than notes you pass back and forth (to the people involved in the planning/discussion/etc). I'd rather spend the forty clicks.

[Fieger]

about 7...I compare one whisper and one note...you can said what you want to said in just one whisper...not in ten...if someone is irritated by whisper he might use his axe...
I suppose that better idea than overhearing is some sort of whisper-filter. You don't have whisper-spam and other can whisper without limitation

about..4..most of implementations are add-on to RP. Something like patch...they might correct sth or gives some new options. This one is like new program which force user to RP in completely another way...

Still against

[Doug R.]

If I'd had time to put in my 2 cents on the actual suggestion before it was implemented, I probably would have said I would prefer something similar to the original suggestion and/or the eavesdropping suggestion.

This was adopted as an alternative, because it was felt it gave a similar effect to the original suggestion (i.e. reduce visual clutter and make private conversations overhearable) but was considerably easier to implement. I too liked the idea of having an evesdropable conversation mechanism, but the ease and speed of adopting the secondary approach was, for me, a reasonable trade-off.

[the_antisocial_hermit]

If I'd had time to put in my 2 cents on the actual suggestion before it was implemented, I probably would have said I would prefer something similar to the original suggestion and/or the eavesdropping suggestion.

This was adopted as an alternative, because it was felt it gave a similar effect to the original suggestion (i.e. reduce visual clutter and make private conversations overhearable) but was considerably easier to implement. I too liked the idea of having an evesdropable conversation mechanism, but the ease and speed of adopting the secondary approach was, for me, a reasonable trade-off.

I understand that was why, but I'd rather wait for something better than take something sub-par immediately.

I don't feel it reduces visual clutter at all. There's still going to be the lines of "so and so whispers to so and so" x 500 and then the occasional slip-up in between. It will just increase it if it's only some sort of boring drivel too.

And like I said, if it were done this way but only heard by a few random people, it'd be better, though I still think those random people should have to expend effort to hear something.

[Piscator]

1. Neither am I. I like having this suggestion more than having it not at all, though, because I think it allows for more RP.
2. That's really their own problem, it's not always about getting projects done. It's not that big of a deal to miss one project tick.

About 1: It only allowes for more rp in the rare instance when something worth hearing leaks out. It hampers roleplay in every other situation.

About 2: It's not "their problem". That's a terribly arrogant thing to say. If it's a problem for some it's at least worth considering. And by the way, Cantr is not always only about roleplaying either.

[playerslayer666]

when people say " it allows for more RP " all i hear is " i just wanna know what they are saying ".....are people so bored at times that they need to resort to reacting to what other people are talking about?

Wiro i can't believe you made your own list in response to fieger's.....i believe that everything he just said was not only perfectly logical but also has been touched on already.

1) not everyone is annoyed by constant whispering. i personally just look for what i need to react to then click " hide " to get rid of it. problem solved.

2) whispering is whispering and should not be heard by anyone. i personally liked having my privacy.

3) not everyone cares to hear what they are saying, even if it has something to do with them. if something bad is about to happen i don't want to know. the element of surprise is one of the few cool things about the game. surprises could also be a bad thing but that is the way of things. it is up to the player to do what he/she can to keep his/her character safe. this randomly hearing whispers thing is only useful for knowing if someone is up to something.

4) i agree that this is only going to force people to change their RP which is why people are still whispering and not using notes. because they DON'T want to change their RP style. honestly the only other use this function has aside from knowing if something bad is going to happen is to force people to change their habbits of having public sex.

5) ditto. little warning for something that was too big of a change. as i've said this is just a text based game. any small change in WOW would mean nothing to the game. any small change to cantr would have a BIG impact because of the games simplicity.

6) if your going to have the function at all i think the chance should be reduced based on population. that makes sense. at least in a city with 100+ characters everything you say won't be heard by at least one person every time you say something.

7) Wiro to say you don't care about this is narow minded. you can't put absolutely everything in one single note and then pass it, because then they need to respond to you, which means you'll need to write back. i liked it better when the game took less effort to play withoutthe worry of people hearing you if your having a personal conversation ( and by personal conversation i mean anything from plotting to public sex. it's not your business what other people are saying or doing and they should not be forced to go inside. besides doesn't it even say in the begining page that some events could take days because of player inactivity? so how long would it take with this new system with an inactive player assuming they don't want others to but in and also would want to remain outside as much as possible?..... )

[*Wiro]

about 7...I compare one whisper and one note...you can said what you want to said in just one whisper...not in ten...if someone is irritated by whisper he might use his axe...
I suppose that better idea than overhearing is some sort of whisper-filter. You don't have whisper-spam and other can whisper without limitation

about..4..most of implementations are add-on to RP. Something like patch...they might correct sth or gives some new options. This one is like new program which force user to RP in completely another way...

Still against

I don't agree with being forced to RP differently. That's entirely up to the way you do it. And this suggestion, too, adds on to RP. A wall of X whispers to Y surely isn't as fun to read or to interact with as the ocassional (there's only a 0,75% chance!) overheard whisper.

[playerslayer666]

About 1: It only allowes for more rp in the rare instance when something worth hearing leaks out. It hampers roleplay in every other situation.

ditto. in most situations it can either take away RP or simply make it harder. i've mentioned this but people like to try and argue that there are still " some " instances where it can create more RP.

this is just a pointless mechanic for people to use to but in on other peoples business. i wish i had an account to tell people to piss off when they try talking to me about my own private conversations.

[playerslayer666]

about 7...I compare one whisper and one note...you can said what you want to said in just one whisper...not in ten...if someone is irritated by whisper he might use his axe...
I suppose that better idea than overhearing is some sort of whisper-filter. You don't have whisper-spam and other can whisper without limitation

about..4..most of implementations are add-on to RP. Something like patch...they might correct sth or gives some new options. This one is like new program which force user to RP in completely another way...

Still against

I don't agree with being forced to RP differently. That's entirely up to the way you do it. And this suggestion, too, adds on to RP. A wall of X whispers to Y surely isn't as fun to read or to interact with as the ocassional (there's only a 0,75% chance!) overheard whisper.

again with the interacting...... i think enough people have already said they don't care to hear your opinion on their own conversation.

[*Wiro]

About 2: It's not "their problem". That's a terribly arrogant thing to say. If it's a problem for some it's at least worth considering. And by the way, Cantr is not always only about roleplaying either.

It is their problem until someone decides to implement it, I didn't really mean it the way I typed it. Sorry for the wrong wording. :S I meant that I don't agree with not adding this feature because of that, and that it is therefore their problem until more suggestions, including making projects less fixed to their location, are implemented. Which isn't going to happen anytime soon, I'm sure. So to shoot down a suggestion because another suggestion that won't be added for a long while is pretty stupid of a reason.

Playerslayer, I have little to say about your replies as I don't think it is possible to have a discussion other than a yes-no-yes-no one with you. But I don't think you should be called people narrow minded for saying they don't care. Because that just doesn't make sense. Which, honestly, without meaning to offend you, is something your posts in general lack IMO.