Overhearing whispers, your opinion

General out-of-character discussion among players of Cantr II.

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Chance to overhear whispers...

...is good as it is.
37
27%
...should be higher than 2% per person.
26
19%
...should be lower in high-pop locations.
8
6%
...should be lower in general.
11
8%
...should not have been implemented at all.
55
40%
 
Total votes: 137
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*Wiro
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Re: Overhearing whispers, your opinion

Postby *Wiro » Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:19 pm

Mars wrote:4. We have a poll on polish forum. 75% polish forumers are not agree with "Overhearing whispers"!


It would help if you would quote + translate a few of their posts so we all know what their opinions are about it.
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Postby Piscator » Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:26 pm

The more I think about it, the more I'm leaning towards a "no".

This change basically reduces the usability of a perfectly good feature (which could up to now be used to roleplay instances where other people simply couldn't listen or even see the characters, e.g. having a walk on the beach or in the woods) to satisfy the curiosity of people who feel left out.

Introducing this change is especially questionable, since the problem could have been solved by in-game means. If people are annoyed by whispering in the town square, make a law against it.
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Postby *Wiro » Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:36 pm

Piscator wrote:This change basically reduces the usability of a perfectly good feature (which could up to now be used to roleplay instances where other people simply couldn't listen or even see the characters, e.g. having a walk on the beach or in the woods) to satisfy the curiosity of people who feel left out.


I would agree with you if people would actually use it like that, like very few do, but they barely ever do.
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Postby Elm0 » Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:40 pm

Why ppl are against? The whole feature could be promising and add some interesting occasions for RP, but don't you think that the poor reception of this idea is caused mostly by the way you implemented it? This whispering 'box of Pandora' was suggested just a few days ago, and was moved to accepted and implemented in the pace of the road-runner, being highly controversial and not even having a support from majority of players. Dear God, ask yourself: what you where thinking? Hatching a little revolution without even polling the ppl, without asking them an opinion, and now complaining about strong counter-reactions... In the same time, there are zilions of concepts which, albeit widely accepted and generally nice to be seen IG, are lying and waiting for the end of the world. And this is, I think, statement from many polish players as you asked about it.

So please: next time ask people (and not only english, cause polish and other players are here too) BEFORE making such a step...

And don't think that I'm against it. This isn't a stupid idea, which some polish ppl suggest, but in my opinion it should be removed, deeply thought over and implemented only after it has all in the proper place. Lowering the chance to 0,1-0,5%, making whispers from ship inaudible on the land and vice versa...
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Postby *Wiro » Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:43 pm

Elm0 wrote:Lowering the chance to 0,1-0,5%, making whispers from ship inaudible on the land and vice versa...


I disagree with such a low chance. That's barely ever. But I agree with the whispers on ships.
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Postby Piscator » Fri Jul 17, 2009 12:51 pm

Well, barely ever should be enough to serve the (not quite) original purpose of the suggestion. The fact alone that your conversation COULD be heard should be enough to let people look for a private spot, whatever the chances are.
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Postby Doug R. » Fri Jul 17, 2009 1:11 pm

I can't read all these pages. It's too much. I think this poll is premature. Once we've hammered out the wrinkles and given it time to work properly, I can post a game-wide poll if we feel that a poll is necessary.
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Postby Arenti » Fri Jul 17, 2009 1:15 pm

I think it's clear that even if it works properly, most of the players are against it.
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Postby Sunni Daez » Fri Jul 17, 2009 1:18 pm

No, this poll shows that about half of the forum goers don't like it. It certainly does not represent the players.
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Postby amika-babilfrenzo » Fri Jul 17, 2009 1:21 pm

Arenti wrote:I think it's clear that even if it works properly, most of the players are against it.


However vocal they are in this discussion, the 54% who voted against are a very small majority. If it were a greater percent we could draw better conclusions.
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Postby Arenti » Fri Jul 17, 2009 1:22 pm

Alright not many of the players vote in the poll on the forum, there should be a poll for all players, for also those who don't use the forum.
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Postby Genie » Fri Jul 17, 2009 2:18 pm

It has been little fast i think and i didn't get how will it be exactly.
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Postby playerslayer666 » Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:17 pm

those who like it suggest it can open up good RP opportunities, which is true, BUT those RP opportunities may sometimes be opened up and the other player won't like it or even care to hear the other persons opinion on whatever they are saying.

and those who are against it ( like me ) suggest it can ruin kidnapping and piracy plots. which kills perfectly good RP scenarios. now if the feature worked so that if they were in their boat and everyone could not possibly hear them then maybe it wouldn't suck so bad, but i doubt it works that way and besides most conversations open up at random based on what's going on so that won't work out very well and passing notes, as some have already thought of, would only show that they have something to hide.

so if you REALLY think this is gonna open up good RP opportunities, guess what, it's not. at least not all the time. if anything it will only ruin them more often then it will help them.

on another note if you have a pirate character or any sort of " evil " toon your plans are better off not even being thought about while in public. any good pirate would do all the planning while still on their boat before they even dock, or while still in their house.

so to all you nub wannabe pirates who think this feature will ruin your plots, that's your own fault for being dumb enough to talk about it around others, regardless of if they can hear you or not. be smart about it at all times or you'll end up in the wrong kind of town where if you whisper too much you'll get killed anyway.

so anyway......why do people suggest this will open up good RP opportunities? sure. maybe it will work once in a while when the feature is still new because people will want to experiment with a new game mechanic. maybe it will continue to work every now and then in a month or so, but not everyone cares to hear what you have to say to them when they are not talking to you and not everyone cares to comment of what people are whispering about. personally any one of my toons ( with the exception of the really nice ones i had ) would smack you for getting involved in their business.

EDIT: for those of you who like the feature don't bother to say it won't always ruin RP opportunities cause the problem is it DOES ruin some RP opportunities/scenarios. for those of you who suggest it should be higher then 2% why don't you just go to the suggestion forums and suggest to ban whsipering period >.>......
Last edited by playerslayer666 on Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby SekoETC » Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:18 pm

Mars wrote:1. In Vlotryan we have ~175 characters, and more then 100 in central location.
Each whisper is heard from 2 persons!


I did notice the percentage was too high so it was changed to per location rather than per person. You should notice a decrease in the amount of whispers heard.

GranAttacker wrote:put a location limit


This was done 4 and a half hours before you posted. You might want to read the previous conversation fully before replying.

Wiro* wrote:Why are you people against? It'd help if you'd say why, so the feature could be adjusted or changed to fit everyone's desires. :S If you just say "blehh this is dumb", no one will know why and then there won't be any changes made to it to fit YOUR needs.


I think this is a very good question. There are many people who support the idea, or would support it if it was made more reasonable, so the only way it's going to be taken away completely is going to make several people disappointed. People should try to see things from other people's perspective and think "if these people support it, couldn't we find some compromise that will satisfy everybody?" If people go all "this is the worst implementation forever and I'm going to quit if you don't take it out!" I'm more prone to think "well, I don't know any of your characters and since you're such a whiner, I'm glad I don't, so go quit and stop whining" but if people specified what was wrong with the implementation (happened too fast, 0% privacy in Vlotryan) your arguments are more likely to be taken into account.

Before the thing was implemented, I made an Excel sheet on the likeliness of a whisper not being heard in towns up to the size of 100, but when I looked at the bottom of the list, I think I forgot it was the probability of being not heard rather than being heard. I think something like 20% being heard would still be acceptable, but 90% certainly is not. As said above, the issue has been addressed.

I think it would also be nice if Cantrians really had the ability to "walk down the beach" or otherwise move away from other people without having to leave the location. But such an implementation would take more effort to code.

playerslayer666 wrote:it can ruin kidnapping and piracy plots. which kills perfectly good RP scenarios. now if the feature worked so that if they were in their boat and everyone could not possibly hear them then maybe it wouldn't suck so bad, but i doubt it works that way and besides most conversations open up at random based on what's going on so that won't work out very well and passing notes, as some have already thought of, would only show that they have something to hide.


If the people are in their boat, they can pass notes without everybody noticing outside. If they were smart pirates, they would work out the plan before docking, to ensure 100% privacy. I found out OOC about such people and they pulled it off perfectly, I saw one of them IC and didn't find him suspicious at all, and I didn't even know there was a second person on the boat. Also I've heard of attackers who plan things in advance and have a code phrase like "Welcome to X" that triggers the violence. And if the chance of being overheard is small enough, people can take the risk because even if someone heard, a chance is it was somebody who's not online and the plan will be put into effect before they wake up. Also we've have people here suggesting people should make a secret language, those things simply wouldn't happen if 100% privacy was guaranteed.
Last edited by SekoETC on Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby playerslayer666 » Fri Jul 17, 2009 3:24 pm

*Wiro wrote:Why are you people against?


OMG ARE YOU KIDDING ME MOST OF THE PEOPLE WHO POST HAVE ALREADY SAID WHY STOP ASKING THIS QUESTION AND READ WHAT PEOPLE ARE SAYING >.<

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