Building rot - DUPE persevered for discussion

[Jaguar45]

A mud hut would be fully destroyed, from first built to everything inside and everyone inside dead in...

10 days from a hammer
5 days from a sledgehammer

Hammer: Still a tool, is a project, requires being inside building
Sledgehammer: Still a tool, is a project, requires being inside

First of all, a collapsing mud hut would most vertainly not kill everybody inside. But that is not my point.
My point is, that who is going to desruct a building if they die inside? Suicidalism is a popular trend in Cantr - some call it being brave and I am pretty sure that actually it is simply boredom. But all those who are willing to risk their lives in an attack against well armed and defended towns hope to survive and plunder the remains. Now what is the glory in destructing a building, gaining nothing from it and dieing in the end?

[Gran]

Ahn, yeah....it's quite nonsense suicidal descontructing buildings.......
But back to the castles, ther would be only castles and an indirect diference about variable towers or a direct diference like:Construct castles, forts, outposts, townwalls, fortifications?

[Crosshair]

I think, Jaguar, he means you can destroy buildings from the outside.

[shapukas]

Hi, evryone. All of you talk about war. But first i think it should be balansed. Becose, now ofensive side has mor power then defensive. Even better armed defensive town cant stand a chans against those ho attak from the sea or lake. Whith sveral small longboats, strongly armed town can be destroyed bay those ho cary only bone spears, or one better weapon. I suggest that there should be some sort of building, whach tower, fort, citadel or castle. Maby fort , citadel and casttle xcould be made out of ordirnary stone building, adding to it some rooms (towers). Entered those towers defenders could see evrything that is going on in that town (outside the castle) and allso attack the attakers. In that case attackers should be better prepared fos seagde then defenders. That is very logical, becouse it is much more esear to defend in casttles then attack them.

[Talapus]

Becose, now ofensive side has mor power then defensive.

I think most people here would disagree with you on this point. The power of dragging, and locked buildings (where you can hide from attacks) should not be underestimated.

[shapukas]

whryly think so? Then how can you explain that whith better wheapon and lockable door town looses to poorely eckuiped "army"? Imagin this. You are a key master. You work at fields. Doks ship, and while you are loged out you are draged in the boat and in several days killed? If it is made bay several sips, then the loses are even grater. So i say, that attakers have grater advantage against defenders. I think that towers arnt hard to put in the game. And in that wai it would be much safer. To be allways loked in the building is not a option. You do not know whats going on outside. In regions that dont have axes to water its ok. Not so bad. But in water it is much more dificult.

[SekoETC]

Yeah and if those people had bone spears and the other party had iron shields, they might block all the damage because defending yourself doesn't raise tiredness. And who's gonna organize a fleet of boats anyway?

[shapukas]

Yeah and if those people had bone spears and the other party had iron shields, they might block all the damage because defending yourself doesn't raise tiredness. And who's gonna organize a fleet of boats anyway?

That should be defensive positions. Something like projekts. Leader strarts the position and others enters them. In that case to brake position needs to be killed bigger part of defenders. But i dont think its is easy to make. Much more easyer to create building, from which you coud see outside and allso attack. Differenc could be just that you culd attack olny whith raged wheapons.

There is allso anothe suggfestion. Could it be posible to build some sort of fense? Wall. or something like that? You could work by gathering resourses behinde those walls and nwecomers coud allso word outside that wall. All that coud be castle. Building in side those walls harbour coud give chans to get acces to water. ofcours through locked harbour nobady could get in town.

But still i think towers in houses is the simplest whay to defend.

[SekoETC]

It would be cool if one could observe the things outside without having to be down there and vulnerable to attacks. Also with a tower, most likely people wouldn't see you coming and going, they could only notice your presense by looking at the people list and in the bottom along with the vehicles, they could see "Town guard John Smith (The tower)".

Defense projects have been suggested in other projects. But something can already be done. Even if you are a poorly armed newspawn and the only one awake when pirates attack, you can start dragging the town leader towards a building (preferably one they have a key for) - this way it's impossible to drag them towards another target as long as you're alive and holding on. But if it's an open building then they could assist with the dragging and subsequently drag the person out of there and onto their ship - but this takes far more time than dragging only once, and increases the chance of getting caught. Oh, and they could also drag you... But again, more fuss, higher chance of someone getting involved.

Some of my characters have been dragging themselves when talking to people they couldn't know if they could trust. I've also witnessed others doing it. But if you want to work on a project, you could hire a poorly skilled person to hold on to you while you're offline. You just need to remember that it stops working if you move.

And naturally this only stops unwanted dragging, not hitting. But it's very rare that a person with an iron shield could be killed overnight, even if there were several attackers.

[shapukas]

... But it's very rare that a person with an iron shield could be killed overnight, even if there were several attackers.

Afcourse. In one night you cant be killed. But in severan days, yes. And very easy. 4 persons against one in their boat. If thei have one spear and lots of healing stuf. Thei kil leader, take his key. Thes robes aeverything thay had. Or at least the moste wanted things. So, tower is verry nessesery. That leader coud allways stay in it, and wach whats going on. To hit him you shoud eather walk into the tower, or use bows as a weapon. That would be perfect defence for evolved towns. It coud be also good to attack whith melee weapons as vel. It doesnt matter. The moste important thing is that he coudns be draged of that tower.

[Solfius]

or you could not carry around all the keys to the buildings.

Give some keys to another leader for example, so if one dies you still have somewhere to hide

[Sicofonte]

You don't need a tower.

Additionally to Seko's tips, you can build a small wooden cart. Inside it, you can't be dragged, you can see, and everyone can attack.


But we have to realize that the working slots are on the fields... on the wide fields. With or without castles or towers, no raw resources slots should be inside.

Try to imagine a keymaster, or better say a king, in the middle age, working in the fields and exposed to enemies' attacks... just absurd, isn't it?. The same in Cantr.


You need to guard your keymasters under lock and key, maybe having some assistant that take care of the things outside (being in charge or passing notes).

[Solfius]

You need to guard your keymasters under lock and key, maybe having some assistant that take care of the things outside (being in charge or passing notes).

Cantr society revolves around the main square, inside with a couple of people is boring as hell and no leader is going to stay inside where they can't directly manage their town.

Unless there is a dramtic shift in the way people use buildings, which I doubt, then people will still stand around outside.

Perhaps if people built rooms to use as meeting halls it wouldn't be so bad, but that would take a lot of effort to put in place as people naturally hang around outside, where they spawn, where they can harvest and mine, where they can hunt, and where most of the action happens

[shapukas]

To share keys isnt an option. By kiling leader enemy gets his key as well. So you cant hide eany more. Staying in a cart isnt very good as wel. Carts act as eany other transport and you cant see some action that goes out side. You cant see when somebody arives, or goes out . You cansee only newbirth. You cant see if somebody took some resourses or not. From towers on other hand you coud see eavrything that goes outside. You coudnt be attacked whith melea weapons and coudnst attack with one.

So ok, no fields in casttles. Thats ok by me. Quite logical. But there should be som whay to build that tower. Or maby to make something that you coud see evruthing whats goung on outside. That woud be at least somesthing.

[Solfius]

if you can't see everything from a cart, why should a building be any different.

And there are ways of hiding and protecting keys, just not terribly practical, but if you're that worried about it it can work.

I like the idea of keep warefare, but I don't see how it can apply to Cantr