British and North American areas

[Pie]

but i do have a boat.

[wichita]

No seriously though.

The reason I suggested it is as an experiment. We could see the difference between our nations in the development of the cantr ones. (...and If things work out as I predict they would. The British area will be far more powerfull than any other. )

I love the idea, but I have a feeling that every place would still be exactly the same, with only minor quirks. It seems that very few people are capable (or at least willing) to get rid of their OOC culture and actually develop something new. I'm guilty of it myself. All we really have are a bunch of little clones of Western society. There are different types of governments, but the underlying culture everywhere seems to me to be very homogenous. (Even my brief experience in the German area has led to me to think that perhaps the segregation into language areas doesn't even change this much.)


It would be really cool if we could start to better market the game to places like China, India, and Japan to broaden the culture base of players even further and see how those areas start to develop culturally.

.

[AoM]

Are you suggesting that there aren't enough areas in Cantr that adopt an Eastern philosophy? Are we too capitalist? Too individualistic?

Could you give some examples of what you see that is blatantly western, and then give examples of blatantly non-western thinking that is seemingly absent?

[DylPickle]

Are you suggesting that there aren't enough areas in Cantr that adopt an Eastern philosophy? Are we too capitalist? Too individualistic?

Could you give some examples of what you see that is blatantly western, and then give examples of blatantly non-western thinking that is seemingly absent?

No Borders, and overly friendly faces all over. Nobody seems to ever want to take over their neighboor. Also the newspawns that pop to life in a violent place, with no knowledge of outside culture, and say "this place is overly violent." "This place has such harsh and stern rules" yady yady.

Just off the top of my head

[AoM]

That's not necessarily western/eastern/whatever thinking. That's just the product of the modern world, where improved global connectedness and awareness creates a better chance for the well informed (or greatly naive) to have empathy for people different from them. Something that was not a possibility in the past societies anywhere around the globe.

Western philosophy during the middle ages was incredibly warlike. Hell, Western philosophy 60 years ago was incredibly warlike. I think those things you just listed aren't so much a symptom of our area of the world so much as the times we live in. (Granted that we aren't exactly living in a utopia today, but you can't really argue that telecommunications and things like the internet haven't caused the upcoming generation to be more connected with others across the world... this forum and the game of cantr being point in case.)

[wichita]

Actually those were the common items the Cantr Soothsayers are always mentioning on the forum that I was thinking about as well.


I guess I was using Western as a very loose and generic term. I wish I could put this into words better....I'm going to fail horribly, so if anyone else feels what I'm trying to get at please throw some phrasing into it.


It seems like a vast majority of characters hold to the paradigm that all men are created equal, have basic human rights, we should celebrate diversity, yada yada yada. Those are sort of the hallmarks of what I generalize as "Western" culture. The things I see under-represented in the more global sense are a strong honor code, Nationalism, etc.....so yeah, Cantr is too capitalistic democracy right now.


But more importantly than that, there isn't that much unique culture that develops - new traditions, expressions, mannerisms, accents, etc. This may be mainly to do with the fact that so many people migrate so easily in the game. There is not a sufficient segregation of populations of active characters for a sufficient amount of time for this to develop. There are a few instances where this has happened - TBR comes to mind immediately - but for the most part it just feels like the midwest without the flag to me, because the characters don't act or talk vastly different from the people I meet in everyday life.


Blah blah blah. Hopefully this made some sense, but I'm probably just rambling.

.

[DylPickle]

I agree completely, Wichita. Traditions, customs, and culture in general are hard to create and pass on because of people spawning out of the blue and not really being raised and edjucated to naturally accept those customs. Marriage ceremonies, funerals, societal classes, accents, even things like different hand gestures, such as salutes or giving someone the finger. Its really hard plop those on people.

[Nick]

we have all those bloodthirsty Canadian players on our side. We would so kick butt.

No comment.

[Lumin]

It's always gotten on my nerves the way every community is exactly the same and everyone so friendly. Even when you live right next door to the MacGregors or the Stone Knights or any of the few violent or obviously "different" cultures it's next to impossible to get anyone worked up into a healthy state of xenophobia. Most of the time if your char so much as mentions they dislike someone you'll get told that they're really good people if you take the time to understand them, you shouldn't be so quick to judge, blah blah blah.

But I think one of the main reasons communities are rarely different is because every character's environment is exactly the same. There might be some differences in the types of animals or the number of animals, but that's about it. There's no real innovation with jewelry or clothing or trade or warfare or anything like that, because all Cantrians have access to the exact same manufacturing list, and that's *all* they have access to. It's not like in real life where people on one country are going to invent something new or live a certain way because it helps them with some problem that people on another continent have never had to deal with.

Also, beit consciously or subconsciously, people use too much OOC knowledge. Think about it; if you had a newspawn who'd never once stepped foot outside the forest they spawned in, and one day a well-dressed, well-armed traveller in his fifties showed up and proceeded to try to trade you a rare map to the lost city of Zafizoofi, where the natives still dug iron directly from the ground, would your newspawn fall for it? Would they even consider it for a nanosecond? Or would they just automatically know that this person was lying to them, just because you as a player know that?

[Jos Elkink]

The reason I suggested it is as an experiment. We could see the difference between our nations in the development of the cantr ones. (...and If things work out as I predict they would. The British area will be far more powerfull than any other. )

And how exactly are you going to avoid that Americans play in the British area and vice versa?

To be sure: I'm quite opposed to this idea ... The English languaged people have enough islands by now ...

[kinvoya]

But I think one of the main reasons communities are rarely different is because every character's environment is exactly the same. There might be some differences in the types of animals or the number of animals, but that's about it. There's no real innovation with jewelry or clothing or trade or warfare or anything like that, because all Cantrians have access to the exact same manufacturing list, and that's *all* they have access to. It's not like in real life where people on one country are going to invent something new or live a certain way because it helps them with some problem that people on another continent have never had to deal with.

I heartily agree, Lumin. I had a short and futile campaign to try to get some kind of non-written, non-personality oriented creativity into the game in the form of art, jewelry and clothing and then gave up. I truly believe that the way this game will take the big leap into a new age of enlightenment is through creativity. I hope someone who understands programming can figure out how to make that possible.

Chars need to have something (other than iron) that other chars really want and/or need. This will stimulate the economy...also greed, crime, warfare and all kinds of delicious naughtiness.

[AoM]

Chars need to have something (other than iron) that other chars really want and/or need. This will stimulate the economy...also greed, crime, warfare and all kinds of delicious naughtiness.

Nah, this would actually stagnate greed, crime, and warfare. These things often occur when there are too many people competing over limited resources.

[kinvoya]

I have also suggested limiting the amout of resources which can be gathered and requiring certain foods for proper nutrition but nooooo....nobody wants the hardship. I would much rather my chars starved while struggling to get something they need than sit around repairing tools day in and day out. At least I would experience something other than annoyance from the game, even if it's grief and despair.

P.S. A one-of-a-kind piece of art is about as limited a resource as you can get. And some chars, I believe, will covet them (maybe just mine. )

[Surly]

Personally I think both those ideas are rubbish, Kinvoya. *shrugs* Just an example of the variety of views in Cantr. But if you shout loud enough, even if it is just you, apparently programming will give in for an easy life... An intriguing idea. Anyway, I'm sure I've made my point...

Anyway, there is no need for seperate islands. Keep things the way they are! (I seem to say that so often without any effect... oh well...)

[kinvoya]

Bite me, Surly.