The Crusades

avi messika · Postby **avi messika** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 1:16 am

Pie, just to start, people do not memorize the entire torah, cantors use shortcuts in order to be able to read each section. It is impossible to memorize it. The torah is not written with a rhythm, it is in fact written with trope, which dictates the tune. I have been chanting from the torah since I was 10 years old ( I was bored in hebrew school, what can I say?) And while the trope and punctuation is not written on the actual scrolls, it is written on printed humashs, which are a printed torah. The tunes, might have been passed down orally, but the torah was written in stages. For instance, the Song of the Sea, which depicts the crossing of the Reed Sea by the Israelites in Exodus 13, was written prior to the rest of the Torah, Rabbinical scholars agree that the Song of the Sea is the oldest text within the bible.

Pie · Postby **Pie** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 2:36 pm

I was talking about... the 1500bc tims, or somthin... Actually, around 32bc is what i mean. Back then(You should know this) The scripturs were held in high regards, the highist of high, they were thought to be the word of god himselff, thus being the most importent text in the intyer world.(To them.) And also... Wouldn't written stuff be held for only the most important priests.. who actually had the mony to buy all of the parchment for the job? Just think of the thousands of goats it would take to make just ONE BOOK OF THE TORA, Thus making memorasation needed for the smaller, more insignifigant priests, or just the populus who wanted to have a deeper faith.

Also... H.F.... I just proved to you, though i digresed a little, that the genesis book COULD NOT have been deludid through translation (that easaly. Unless you translate it frome hebrew to greek, greek to french, french to spanish, spanish to chinees, chinees to japanees, japanees to english, it couldn't have been deluded easaly.)

Also i have prooved to you that those accounts in genesis COULD HAVE BEEN first hand expireances.

formerly known as hf · Postby **formerly known as hf** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 5:51 pm

Pie wrote:Also... H.F.... I just proved to you, though i digresed a little, that the genesis book COULD NOT have been deludid through translation (that easaly.

Balls pie, complete and utter hairy smelly balls.
I don;t suppose you speak another language fluently? It hardly seems you can even speak english fluently sometimes.
If you could, you would know that in many languages there are expressions, words, phrases that just can not be translated into another language. More often than not, this is for cultural reasons, it is the differences in culture as well as langugae that do not translate.
Hence even one translation - direct from Hebrew to English - is open to being diluted/changed. As you know there is (many) more than one English translation of the Bible - all from the same original text - and all quite different from one another. So clearly things do get changed in translation, otherwise there would only be one English version, but there isn't, because things can be translated in different ways.

pie wrote:Also i have prooved to you that those accounts in genesis COULD HAVE BEEN first hand expireances.

I COULD HAVE flown into space - if I has moved to the US and trained as an astronaut - but I didn't.

avi messika · Postby **avi messika** » Sat Jan 21, 2006 10:57 pm

Pie wrote:I was talking about... the 1500bc tims, or somthin... Actually, around 32bc is what i mean. Back then(You should know this) The scripturs were held in high regards, the highist of high, they were thought to be the word of god himselff, thus being the most importent text in the intyer world.(To them.) And also... Wouldn't written stuff be held for only the most important priests.. who actually had the mony to buy all of the parchment for the job? Just think of the thousands of goats it would take to make just ONE BOOK OF THE TORA, Thus making memorasation needed for the smaller, more insignifigant priests, or just the populus who wanted to have a deeper faith.

Also... H.F.... I just proved to you, though i digresed a little, that the genesis book COULD NOT have been deludid through translation (that easaly. Unless you translate it frome hebrew to greek, greek to french, french to spanish, spanish to chinees, chinees to japanees, japanees to english, it couldn't have been deluded easaly.)

Also i have prooved to you that those accounts in genesis COULD HAVE BEEN first hand expireances.

The Torah is still printed on parchment. All "books" are combined in hebrew, those are the only places in the entire torah that can be distinguished as separations. Each Torah nowadays costs upwards of 40,000 dollars because they are still written and read with the upmost respect. There is a person who still sits and inscribes every letter of the Torah by hand, taking years to do so.

While the point I made helps yours slightly, what I am trying to get across is the point that Judaism STILL considers written texts to be sacred. In Judaism, scrolls that are printed are not kosher and therefore can not be used. But the priests were not the rich of that day. In those times, the Torah was not yet written, Judaism relied solely on animal sacrifices.

Only after the destrustion of the second temple and the expulsion of the Jews were the Talmud, Torah, Nevi'im, and Ktuvim written. These were written as a way for Jews all over the Diaspora to be able to practice without needing to sacrifice at the temple...a little known fact about Judaism.

Pie · Postby **Pie** » Sun Jan 22, 2006 4:31 pm

And thus bestow the need to memorise the teachings of such people like moses, and everyone els, to continue a sacred tradition of passing doun stories of the past frome generation to generation, and perhaps some were written doun, then turned into a bible, as my sight has told about moses and the writing of genesis.

Stan · Postby **Stan** » Sun Jan 22, 2006 5:39 pm

avi messika wrote:Only after the destrustion of the second temple and the expulsion of the Jews were the Talmud, Torah, Nevi'im, and Ktuvim written. These were written as a way for Jews all over the Diaspora to be able to practice without needing to sacrifice at the temple...a little known fact about Judaism.

That is very interesting to me. Please explain this more. I had no idea. I have wondered manyt times how Jews today could atone since the temple had been destroyed.

Can you please give more detail? Thank you.

The Crusades

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