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Do you agree?

Poll ended at Sat Apr 22, 2006 9:23 pm

Disagree with 1, 2 & 3
15
48%
Disagree with 2 & 3
0
No votes
Disagree with 3
2
6%
I don't wanna take sides
6
19%
Agree with all
8
26%
 
Total votes: 31
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Stan
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Postby Stan » Tue May 30, 2006 1:13 am

Mykeyrools wrote:The world would not SUCK so bad if more poeple thought like you,West :)


I agree with that statement to a point and I agree with West's comments to a point.

If Christians, or those that consider themselves such, and people of other faiths and those that don't believe would love other people as West describes the world certainly would be a better place.

As far as the other side of death and how to get to the good side if there is even such a place...I agree no one can know 100%. There are times (days, weeks, years, etc) when even the staunchest Christian, Muslim, etc would doubt or, at least, question their beliefs. I believe this is healthy and programmed into our nature by God Himself.

I think it's important to test your beliefs and see if they hold true. Put to the test the things you've learned and find out which things lead to greater life for you and for others and which lead to anger, disappointment and heart break.
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Nalaris
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Postby Nalaris » Tue May 30, 2006 4:43 am

Jack Dudeman wrote: but I can't imagine any government enforcing so-called morality laws


Sad, isn't it?

Homosexually is utterly unnatural. Find me one other species that does it. Just one. There is nothing that even comes close.

National Institute for Mental Health (NIMH) wrote:Another series of MRI studies is shedding light on how teens may process emotions differently than adults. Using functional MRI (fMRI), a team led by Dr. Deborah Yurgelun-Todd at Harvard's McLean Hospital scanned subjects' brain activity while they identified emotions on pictures of faces displayed on a computer screen.5 Young teens, who characteristically perform poorly on the task, activated the amygdala, a brain center that mediates fear and other "gut" reactions, more than the frontal lobe. As teens grow older, their brain activity during this task tends to shift to the frontal lobe, leading to more reasoned perceptions and improved performance. Similarly, the researchers saw a shift in activation from the temporal lobe to the frontal lobe during a language skills task, as teens got older. These functional changes paralleled structural changes in temporal lobe white matter.


Tadaa! Scientific proof that teenagers will react more with gut insticts than higher thought and rationalization. Do we really want to unleash that on our sophisticated society? I admit, treating all teenagers as guilty until proven innocent is a breach of justice, but still, my point stands.
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Mykey
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:

Postby Mykey » Tue May 30, 2006 4:49 am

It agree, a remarkable piece
Last edited by Mykey on Thu Jan 14, 2010 10:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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the_antisocial_hermit
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Postby the_antisocial_hermit » Tue May 30, 2006 4:53 am

Nalaris wrote:Tadaa! Scientific proof that teenagers will react more with gut insticts than higher thought and rationalization.


There is no true, set-in-stone proof, only high correlations, especially when such things can be affected by so many other factors that may or may not have been weeded out during the studies. Proof is one of the worst words to use when describing a study's results.

There's a high correlation of storks migrating and babies being born in the spring. Does that prove that storks are the cause of babies being born?

Oh, and in reference to the homosexuality thing.. I think several people have posted examples of other species on this very board many times.
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Postby Antichrist_Online » Tue May 30, 2006 9:49 am

In the approximately 1,000 to 3,000 species whose behavior has been well researched and described in the literature, approximately 450 have been shown to have clear homosexual behaviors.


Yes, no other species does it apart from those 450 known ones... :roll:
http://www.bidstrup.com/sodomy.htm was where I got this from, but other sites show a simlar list (though not as well explained.) Such as http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-human_animal_sexuality.

And I agree with Hermi, Correlation doesn't equal connection.
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Chris Johnson
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Postby Chris Johnson » Tue May 30, 2006 10:37 am

Nalaris wrote:
National Institute for Mental Health (NIMH) wrote:
....5 Young teens, who characteristically perform poorly on the task,


Tadaa! Scientific proof that teenagers will react more with gut insticts than higher thought and rationalization.


A sample of 5 pre-selected because they perform differently from others on a particular task is hardly scientifc proof of anything. At most it's an observation over time of those individuals.

Hey lets get a group 5 children who do well on written Nepalase, track them over time and then say all teenagers have a tendancy to live in Katmandu . :roll:
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Postby formerly known as hf » Tue May 30, 2006 10:57 am

You know who I hate?
Mormons
Damned weirdos.

Totally un-natural, I can't think of any other species that believes in that rubbish.

All that barn-raising and polygamy - let alone how in-bred they all are. Disgusting I say. Think about the children!

Lock them up and throw away the key I say. The world would be a better place without all their hat-wearing and tea-totalness.
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formerly known as hf
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Postby formerly known as hf » Tue May 30, 2006 11:42 am

Nalaris wrote:
National Institute for Mental Health (NIMH) wrote:Another series of MRI studies is shedding light on how teens may process emotions differently than adults. Using functional MRI (fMRI), a team led by Dr. Deborah Yurgelun-Todd at Harvard's McLean Hospital scanned subjects' brain activity while they identified emotions on pictures of faces displayed on a computer screen.5 Young teens, who characteristically perform poorly on the task, activated the amygdala, a brain center that mediates fear and other "gut" reactions, more than the frontal lobe. As teens grow older, their brain activity during this task tends to shift to the frontal lobe, leading to more reasoned perceptions and improved performance. Similarly, the researchers saw a shift in activation from the temporal lobe to the frontal lobe during a language skills task, as teens got older. These functional changes paralleled structural changes in temporal lobe white matter.


Tadaa! Scientific proof that teenagers will react more with gut insticts than higher thought and rationalization. Do we really want to unleash that on our sophisticated society? I admit, treating all teenagers as guilty until proven innocent is a breach of justice, but still, my point stands.
Ok... Having spent the last year studying this, I will now proceed to fill this post with academic studies that have shown the ability of teenagers to make rational, weighted choices, and are fully at grasp with their own emotions and descisions.

Chidlress, H (2000) Landscapes of betrayal, landscapes of joy : Curtisville in the lives of its teenagers Albany : State University of New York Press: Showed very clearly the maturity of teenagers in descision making, and their constant frustration at being confronted by the two tier system which sees both teenagers as criminals, and guilty, and at the same time, as being 'too young' to make 'proper' descisions.

Gill Valentine has written extensively on childhood. Her studies, both as books and academic papers, cover the way in which childhood, and the assumptions it brings, are purely modern, western inventions. She has expanded this theory to fit many of her studies. The theory itself, being linked to the seminal work by Phillipe Aries' Centuries of Chldhood (1962) which shows very clearly that the concept of childhood and teenager as seperate life stages did not exist until at least the 17th Century, and did not take it's current form until the Victorian era.

150 years ago - teenagers, those 14 and above, were regularly working, getting married, living 'adult' lives. Clearly seen to be able to make rational, adult descisions.

Has there been so much change in the neural physiology of humans in the past Century that teenagers are somehow less 'rational'? Or maybe the 'science' you posted is just utter crap? And badly mis-quoted by yourself.

Let's leave sociology and the like aside now, seeing that you seem to like the neurology and biology side of things.

Shaw et al. Recently (March 2006) Produced Intellectual ability and cortical development in children and adolescents (NATURE 440 (7084): 676-679) Which showed how cortical development is closely linked to intelligence. They concluded that cortical development was not predicated by age, and that cortical development between children, adolescents and adults was dynamic, in that it was not possible to seperate the development of the brain or intelligence by age of the subject.

O'Donnel et al. (2005) Cortical thickness of the frontopolar area in typically developing children and adolescents Neuroimage, Vol. 24(4): Show clearly how, yes, the brain develops over childhood. We all know that. But, what they confirm, which is the generally understood position amoing neurobiologists, is that whilst there is development over age most 'adult' features of the brain are firmly in place at the onset of adolescents, and there is little brain development between then and 'adulthood'. What they also confirm, is that the differences between development of children the same ages are great, and that whilst the brain develops over time, it does os at very different rates for different people.

Casey, Galvan and Hare (2005) Changes in cerebral functional organization during cognitive development -Current Opinion in Neurobiology Volume 15, Issue 2-: Again, show that some brain development is correlated with age, primarily the cognitive areas. What they note, however, is that other developments, those which are arguably the 'social' parts of the brain, are not correlated with age. They are much more specific to the individual and other factors.

I can go on, if you'd like?

Do we really want to unleash that on our sophisticated society?
A sophisticated society is one which has space for considering teenagers as mentaly and intelligently equal as adults. A sophisticated society is one which does not mark all people of a similar age with the same brush, and does not see age as a pre-requisite for rationality, or intelligence. A sophisticated society is one which can accept that teenagers are fully functional human beings who are the experts on their own experiences, and are thus in the best position to make descisions on what affects them. A sophisticated society is one which is not based upon, or even has the space to accommodate the bigoted, predjudiced, short-sighted and disgustingly intollerant outlook that you put forward.
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Pie
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Postby Pie » Tue May 30, 2006 4:03 pm

Alright...... Didn't read any of that... I don't know what's happening.... ok, we apear to be debaiting about tenagers, and there right to responsability.

Ok, you know what I think? I think they should give fourteen year olds a chans to get a drivers lisence. Do you know why? BECOUS I'M ABOUT TO BE FOURTEEN!!! AND becous getting a drivers licens envolves a test. So not just anyone can get a drivers lisence.

Anyone has a right to responsability. You just need to get a test, thingy, to see if you are responsible enough to have responsability. Such as a drivers test.

And also, The responsability of a teenager is mesured by brain power(in a minoraty) but mostly lifestyle. So obviously, kids back in the midevle ages would actually be more responable, becous of the limiting sociaty back then. But nowadays..... I'm not quite shure....
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west
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Postby west » Tue May 30, 2006 4:05 pm

hallucinatingfarmer wrote:You know who I hate?
Mormons
Damned weirdos.

Totally un-natural, I can't think of any other species that believes in that rubbish.

All that barn-raising and polygamy - let alone how in-bred they all are. Disgusting I say. Think about the children!

Lock them up and throw away the key I say. The world would be a better place without all their hat-wearing and tea-totalness.


Barn-raising and hat-wearing are the Amish (and Mennonites), and they never hurt a fly. And the mainstream Mormons have nothing to do with polygamy. Actually, the leader of a splinter cult of polygamists, Warren Jeffs, has just been added to the FBI's 10 Most Wanted List. I'd be interested to see what Josh Monkey has to say about Warren Jeffs, or the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in general, or if he even knows they exist.
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PRUT
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Postby PRUT » Tue May 30, 2006 4:54 pm

Nalaris wrote:
Homosexually is utterly unnatural. Find me one other species that does it. Just one. There is nothing that even comes close.


Just one? hmm.... my dog?!
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Postby Sarah » Tue May 30, 2006 5:22 pm

Pie wrote:Ok, you know what I think? I think they should give fourteen year olds a chans to get a drivers lisence. Do you know why? BECOUS I'M ABOUT TO BE FOURTEEN!!! AND becous getting a drivers licens envolves a test. So not just anyone can get a drivers lisence.


Here, you can get a restricted drivers licence when you are 14 if you pass the written test, but an adult has to be in the vehicle with you every time. At 15, if you pass the actual driving test, you can drive yourself to school but nowhere else.

And they're trying to raise the age for drivers licences to 18 here. :shock: I know that a lot of 16-year-olds drive like idiots, but not being able to drive yourself at 16 would be so inconvenient. Old people can be just as bad drivers, so where's the upper age restrictions?
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Postby the_antisocial_hermit » Tue May 30, 2006 5:24 pm

Sarah wrote:
Pie wrote:Ok, you know what I think? I think they should give fourteen year olds a chans to get a drivers lisence. Do you know why? BECOUS I'M ABOUT TO BE FOURTEEN!!! AND becous getting a drivers licens envolves a test. So not just anyone can get a drivers lisence.


Here, you can get a restricted drivers licence when you are 14 if you pass the written test, but an adult has to be in the vehicle with you every time. At 15, if you pass the actual driving test, you can drive yourself to school but nowhere else.

And they're trying to raise the age for drivers licences to 18 here. :shock: I know that a lot of 16-year-olds drive like idiots, but not being able to drive yourself at 16 would be so inconvenient. Old people can be just as bad drivers, so where's the upper age restrictions?


Plus the fact kids should have driving experience for a couple of years before being sent off to college to survive on their own...
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Dee
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Postby Dee » Tue May 30, 2006 5:26 pm

Heh.. The license here is given by the age of 18....
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Postby Valsum » Tue May 30, 2006 5:56 pm

18 here too, although I got it last month, at the age of 22 :)

I was lazy :)
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