TBR and Noniwrok, historical discussion. (No war talk)

[AoM]

This is a thread created primarily to discuss the events and occurances on K-isle (Noniwrok) that have led to many tragic confrontations that still threaten to continue on indefinitely between TBR and the peoples of Noniwrok.

Because the book is not closed on any of the involved organizations, it is imperative that the events of the current confrontation not be discussed in any way, shape or form. The goal here is to gather opinions and views and try to form an objective historical take on how the the island became so fractured and turned against itself.

The future of TBR and Noniwrok is not up for speculation here, this is only a look at the past. As current events fade into the past and conclude beyond a measure of a doubt, they can be discussed here as well.

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To start with, I shall indicate the points of view that I had on the intrigues of Noniwrok. I was Commander/Senator Naleph Nayr of the Karnon Imperial Republic. I was also Kaiyuu Meisora, one time Councilor of Kwor and follower of the Holy Order created by Archprelate Lopan. Thirdly, I was Zavienda Sionodel of Firecam Inc. though this third personality was a shut-in who was not very active during the involvements of TBR, but she was privy to some conversations behind closed doors in those organizations.

In an OOC nature, I believe that I have a good idea of some of the motivations behind the Noniwrok movement, but because I was devoid of a TBR character, I cannot speak for their perspective. Here are some bullet points for conversation topics, and certainly the list should be added on to by others.

- Day 1000, the dissolution of the Collective, and the beginning of TBR independance.

- The ENA (Eastern Noniwrok Alliance). Did it really exist?

- Events at Karnon Seaside. Was it a massacre? Who in TBR knew about it?

- Firecam confrontation with Ethan Blackrock. What happened, and what were the motivations on either side?

- Karnon/TBR "Cold War". Karnon strikes first, but only draws into a standstill. What were they trying to do?

- TBR presence on Kwor Beach; Lord Nick's brief visit to Kwor.

- Resource restrictions, attempts at peace, and views from within TBR. What was going on in Karnon Forest while the island grew angry?

- Gathering of forces in Karnon, delayed march on Karnon (Blackrock) Forest, and the Tribe's Exodus.

- Aftermath in the forest. Island's reaction to TBR's exile.

- Attack on Kirrin, reasons for it, and the perception of it from Noniwrok.

[Rustoleum]

For starters, this is how my K-isle character witnessed these events:

The "cold war" more or less started when the elected government and the collective were overthrown and didn't really begin in earnest until TBR declared the road closed and streams of mangled and/or starving newspawns started arriving with their stories.

At the time, Karnon had a severe steel shortage and was underequipped for any kind of assault, much less one into that warren of locked buildings in the forest.

The "first strike", if I remember correctly, was actually caused by some people falling asleep on the road and failing to stop, and thus the prisoner taking began.

[AngelSpice]

One of my charries picked up a note on the FNA (Free Noniwok Association) when Nayn Carille died listing names and ranks, so I think it existed. This charrie made a trip once to Karnon Forest and thought Lord Nick was going to kill her from coming from the same town Nayn did. He questioned my charrie about the ENA which she'd never heard of. She asked Nayn about ENA when she got back and was told that Nayn had never heard of it. True, it seems, cause it appears it was the FNA. That charrie was the one who received the General's letter from Kirinn and sent it on to Andrea McTack who she knew had a motorbike and could spread the word fast.

A charrie of mine by the name of Alexander was murdered by Ethan and his crew in Karnon Seaside when they took over, along with his boss. I didn't keep logs but I remember Ethan saying "Might makes Right" and that was all the excuse they needed.

I could comment on the views of a couple more points with a third charrie, but that would out them and I don't want that

[kinvoya]

I've never heard of the FNA. What was it all about?

[nitefyre]

One of my charries picked up a note on the FNA (Free Noniwok Association) when Nayn Carille died listing names and ranks, so I think it existed. This charrie made a trip once to Karnon Forest and thought Lord Nick was going to kill her from coming from the same town Nayn did. He questioned my charrie about the ENA which she'd never heard of. She asked Nayn about ENA when she got back and was told that Nayn had never heard of it. True, it seems, cause it appears it was the FNA. That charrie was the one who received the General's letter from Kirinn and sent it on to Andrea McTack who she knew had a motorbike and could spread the word fast.

A charrie of mine by the name of Alexander was murdered by Ethan and his crew in Karnon Seaside when they took over, along with his boss. I didn't keep logs but I remember Ethan saying "Might makes Right" and that was all the excuse they needed.

I could comment on the views of a couple more points with a third charrie, but that would out them and I don't want that

I can neither confirm nor deny the existence of the East Nonirowk Alliance....


I could tell you, actually, but I'd have to shoot you afterwards. That is one herstory I will not part so easily with.

[Bran-Muffin]

The ENA was founded by Andrea Mctack (nitefyre) and Suzima DeDannan, they were the first to actually strike a blow against TBR and possibly the reason the entire thing happened. That is how my character saw it.

I believe the ENA was formed after Duncan and several others attacked a man in Kwor and tried to bully the town. When the news about that reached the Forest, Nick saw his oportunity to take full control of the Tribe and quickly declared that they were not real members of the Tribe. He said that he would go after them but never really put an effort into that, wanting to let the island deal with the renegades. A few years after that the Tribe tried to set up an outpost in Kwor Southern Fields on the coal supply. That is when the ENA stepped in and killed the members of the Tribe setting up the outpost. News of that was slow to reach the Forest until Nick sent someone out who was able to get a note with a list of people and a battle plan formed by Mctack and I assume Suzima. Karnon was told that TBR would strike back at them, they were given a copy of the ENA battle plan but Nayr and Jules ignored it for some reason. Those series of events led up to Ethan taking a group to kidnap and Kill Suzima, spoiled only because Firecam mysteriously knew about it and were in the town with Suzima at the time of the attack.


That is my take on the ENA... give me a minute will get something about the rest written.

[Bran-Muffin]

- Day 1000, the dissolution of the Collective, and the beginning of TBR independance.

The Tribe decided that Rick O'shea and The Collective's puppet government wasnt doing anything for the town. It really was a spontanious take over that was intended to be a peacful one. It started with Rick saying that TBR could not hold two postions within the government at the same time, even though he and Norbert had held two. TBR held a quick meeting then went outside to lock away the three remaining members of the Collective, massive dragging errors caused this to turn violent when Ben woke up and saw that Rick had been dragged inside. Same thing happened after about 10 minutes of the dragging project being 144% on Norbert when Rick woke up and ran outside, still holding a key to the TBR HQ.

When my character saw Rick comming outside he ordered his people to attack, some hits went through some didnt. Rick and Ben loaded their bikes then left town, Ben spoke with some man I dont remember his name and told him to run to karnon saying that TBR had murdered everyone in the Forest.

Start of the First "Cold War" between the two.

[|william|]

Karnon never got any 'battle plan'... only a copy of who the ENA members were.

[15454]

My charrie was living in Karnon Seaside when this thing started. One day he just woke up and Ethan and a bunch of other people decleared that it was their town now. He ran far far away. lol but he still lives. At one point he just though to commit suicide and go into the forests. But nah he turned around.

[Bran-Muffin]

Karnon never got any 'battle plan'... only a copy of who the ENA members were.

The battle plan was on the same note as the list of members. I dont know which person it was, Nayr or Jules, but I know for a fact that they got a complete copy of the letter.


Answer this question for me.



If Tbr was so hell bent on war why the hell would they try to have peace with Karnon when they could have walked in and killed every single person in the town? The Tribe had fourty + people all but the very newspawns had sabres and iron shields. Most of the Oldest members had crowbars. Karnons best weapon at the time was a Compostie Recurve Bow. If we were so hell bent for war why would we try for peace when we could have killed anyone we wanted?

[|william|]

There are no battle plans on the note my character was given. Could have been given to a different one, but mine never got any such battle plan. Only members and what their purpose was, which was to make an alliance against any aggression from TBR.

As for your question, I don't know. I was not in charge of the Blackrocks, so I can't answer that.

What I can say is that Karnon never trusted TBR. Maybe at first, for a little while. My character tried to extend himself to bring in some trust, but in the end, it failed, mainly due to all the 'stories' people kept coming up with when they came into town about TBR.

[AoM]

Brandon, let's be honest. The biggest threat Karnon had was not the standard of their weapons. It was the fact that, like TBr, they had a lot of deep buildings with locks on the doors. And they had a lot of young active people at the time that could drag invaders.

While TBr certainly had the ability to conceive an attack against Karnon, I doubt it would have been the "clean sweep" you suggest.


As for the battle plan against the ENA. Nayr and Jules were never convinced that the ENA actually existed. They had only the word of TBR on this. They also realized that Karnon, if it did activate its military into attacking towards the east, would only end up being a buffer for TBR if there was retaliation. Any resistance that hated TBR like the ENA note suggested would have to go through Karnon to get to KF. Jules and Nayr agreed that Karnon would never become a puppet state of anyone, and agreed to a plan of non-action. We wouldn't go ahead and attack ENA, but for the time being, we wouldn't deny TBR from sending teams out.

Ethan's attack on Karnon Seaside really was what turned Karnon off to TBR permanantly. The people at the Seaside, while certainly not Karnon supporters, were known and respected by the Republic. We (the commanders of the Karnon forces) did not believe for a second that the Seasiders could have conceivably been planning an attack against TBR as was suggested.

As Brandon has said, TBR had 40+ members with only the newspawns having less than sabres and iron shields. There were at max 6 people living at the Seaside, and maybe one or two had decent weapons and armor. No vehicles. Two buildings, no secondary rooms, and only one locked door. The writing on the wall seemed clear to Karnon. TBR and Lord Ethan had commited murder and blamed an as-yet-to-be-seen enemy (ENA) as the reason for it. Karnon was the weaker of the two powers and could not attack without risking a TBR invasion, so we bided our time and sent out missives to other parts of the island.

I know for one that Nayr, to his dying day, always regreted not standing up for the people of the Seaside when they needed defenders most. And he hated TBR from that moment onward.

[Bran-Muffin]

- Resource restrictions, attempts at peace, and views from within TBR. What was going on in Karnon Forest while the island grew angry?

The resources restrictions were placed in order to raise trade. Tbr wanted things that the island had and everyone wanted the hematite. They were cruel in enforcing this law because they needed things to, if you went and gathered something to trade then you could have had some hematite.

- Events at Karnon Seaside. Was it a massacre? Who in TBR knew about it?

Almost everyone knew about it. Ethan was sent there in order to prevent Karnon from Boxing them in. People in the town were killed because Ethan claimed to have found information that one of the woman leaders was only setting up an outpost for the ENA to strike the Forest from.

- Firecam confrontation with Ethan Blackrock. What happened, and what were the motivations on either side?

I mentioned the reason for Ethan to be in the town that this took place in earlier. Why Firecam was there I have no clue really.

Karnon/TBR "Cold War". Karnon strikes first, but only draws into a standstill. What were they trying to do?

Funny what Rustoleum said about that. If they left to Karnon they were killed. No exceptions. The exact same thing that Karnon was doing on the road to the Forest. Tbr had actually set up services for the town, gave them a place to work, sleep and a place to get FREE food. They wouldnt have starved or been hurt if their ooc influence didnt get the better of them.

- TBR presence on Kwor Beach; Lord Nick's brief visit to Kwor.

After members of Firecam had killed Ethan most of his keys were lost. Later a newspawn who found the keys, notes and everything else Ethan had on him ran through the Seaside stealing steel, iron, leather and other resources out of the locked buildings, then stole a TBR Longboat. Someone sent word to Nick about the theft and he shrugged it off until one of his spies found out that the longboat was in Kwor Beach and the resources unloaded into a building there. Nick sent some people to get the resources back, the people refused and one member of the town allowed Nicks people to use her building, because Tbr had helped her get the wood and iron for it. Four people were locked up, three of them were killed and one escaped to Kwor claiming that TBR was in middle of massacring the town. Firecam once again came running, killed one member of the Tribe then took another captive. After some of the resources were back in Tribe hands, Nick sent his people home and rode into Kwor alone. He told the story of what happened and Demanded that Kwor made Firecam release his man. Kwor wouldnt get involved and so Nick said if anything happens to him Kwors leaders would pay the price, then left town.

- Gathering of forces in Karnon, delayed march on Karnon (Blackrock) Forest, and the Tribe's Exodus.

- Aftermath in the forest. Island's reaction to TBR's exile.

Obviously cant comment on that, I wasnt there.

- Attack on Kirrin, reasons for it, and the perception of it from Noniwrok.

After the Tribe left the Forest after their years of planning then the Rush they had put on them after hearing the news of the massive army heading for them the Tribe sailed into Fu Put Kotan with hopes of finding peace at last. Firecam followed them, made a few threats then started sailing back to Kwor to report where the Tribe was (I guess). Tbr held another mass meeting and decided to give the island what they wanted, and evil TBR. We sailed into Kirrin, kidnaped the three leaders. One got away when the Galleon was left unlocked (dont know why) and so Nick ordered Llyods death for the woman stealing his boat, Celina brought her back then Tbr docked back into town. The town was empty of everyone except the 5-8 sleepers. Nick had keys then after killing Llyod and locked those sleepers up. After that they decided to leave. At that time someone brave enough docked onto their Galleon and managed to rescue the other two members they had captured. (Galleon was unlocked again for some reason.)

[Bran-Muffin]

Brandon, let's be honest. The biggest threat Karnon had was not the standard of their weapons. It was the fact that, like TBr, they had a lot of deep buildings with locks on the doors. And they had a lot of young active people at the time that could drag invaders.

While TBr certainly had the ability to conceive an attack against Karnon, I doubt it would have been the "clean sweep" you suggest.

The Tribe had about 6 bikes under their control around that time (I think it was that.. 4-6 area). Tbr, Collective and Firecam bikes mixed in their hands. Some would have died but the people on the bikes would have been enough to kill the top members of the town, take their keys and not have to worry about the active newpawns. Cant drag someone off of a locked bike into a building. Some of us would have died yes, but it would have been worth it if we wanted a war.

[|william|]

- Gathering of forces in Karnon, delayed march on Karnon (Blackrock) Forest.

- Aftermath in the forest. Island's reaction to TBR's exile.

After finally agreeing to attack TBR at Karnon Forest. Karnon quickly mobilized its troops and appointed Senator Nayr as the general. Which from me as a player was a stupid choice, but IG it was the right choice. Had I been able to be more active during this time, I (Jules) would have went as the General instead and things would have gone down much more differently. Anyways, I was barely active during this time period and Nayr was always extremely thickheaded. Sorry AoM, but he was, at least in my character and players eyes. He prematurely ordered the march, several soldiers followed him, several fell alseep, and the rest of our impressive army was scratching their heads still sitting in Karnon. The troops were no where near ready to move against TBR, so Jules ordered the quick return of Nayr and the few troops who actually followed him to Blackrock forest. Soon after his return, our army fell in a bad way. Many soldiers died or just slept. So, we turned to the help of the rest of the island... Kwor, Firecam, The DeDannons, KORT, and apparently word spread about our massive mobilization of troops from all, we even got word from ENA which came out of the closet, sort to speak.

As for the aftermath in the forest, I wasn't there but had I been there, it would have been much more smoother and less anti-Karnon, thanks to thickheaded soldiers and itchy trigger hands from what I heard. I wish I would have been there, my character would have made things completely different.

Brandon, let's be honest. The biggest threat Karnon had was not the standard of their weapons. It was the fact that, like TBr, they had a lot of deep buildings with locks on the doors. And they had a lot of young active people at the time that could drag invaders.

While TBr certainly had the ability to conceive an attack against Karnon, I doubt it would have been the "clean sweep" you suggest.

The Tribe had about 6 bikes under their control around that time (I think it was that.. 4-6 area). Tbr, Collective and Firecam bikes mixed in their hands. Some would have died but the people on the bikes would have been enough to kill the top members of the town, take their keys and not have to worry about the active newpawns. Cant drag someone off of a locked bike into a building. Some of us would have died yes, but it would have been worth it if we wanted a war.

I think it would really have depended on when you would have attacked. As I mentioned, before our first attempted mobilization of the army, we had a strong force of active and trigger happy soldiers. And we had five bikes. It would have been a bloody fight, had it happened.

But, when they were recalled because the first attempt was done sloppy, everything began to fall apart and TBR would have easily killed Karnon, no doubt.

Either way, it would have been exciting, too bad it never happened.