New Players = Warm Welcome? Not really I guess...

[Lisje]

Let me preface this by saying I searched the forums thoroughly before starting a character in this world, and even though I didn't find much to go on, I thought I'd take a risk with several of my secondary online characters. This is what I encountered after reading the notes in Karnon Forest early this morning, which explicitly forbade hunting, and said to go to the hall to meet their leader for supplies, and that new players had 3 days to join or leave.

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1200-1: You enter Setanta Clan, where you see 3 people, leaving the central area of Karnon Forest.

1200-1: You knock on the door to Store Room. (It was locked)

1200-1: You enter Karnon Forest, where you see 36 people, (none of whom were named or spoke to me, btw) leaving Setanta Clan.

(went offline, hoping to find friendlier people in the evening, as this around 7:30 AM EST)

1200-2: You see a woman in her twenties pointing at you.

1200-2: a woman in her twenties says: "Erin, does this woman have permission to start the wood project she started today?"

1200-2: a woman in her twenties says: "No she doesn't, Alhana, and she also hasn't given her name. Help me drag please."

1200-2: You are being dragged to Karnon Forest Detention Centre where you see 3 people, from the central area of Karnon Forest.

1200-3: You are hungry.

(logged back on to find the above text - my hurt reply, below, has yet to be answered - and I do tend to cry when hurt even online, so I sometimes lash out to stave off the tears)

1200-5: You say: "OK, I'm a veteran of text adventures from the old Infocom days - but I admit as to not having the foggiest of what is going on here, shy of some bullying, even after researching the forums. I somehow lost the link to input text, and I tend to think you are all terribly rude - your post said you had 3 days, and NO HUNTING in that time, which I followed"

1200-5: You say: "But that's fine, everyone who says this is a "friendly game" obviously lie - so why should I waste my time figuring it out? I guess I was spawned into one of the bigger bully communities (thinking "ganker clan" rather than "RPG guild" atm) and I WILL go post my digust to the forums - thanks for the warm welcome guys!"

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I am a veteran of many online games, mostly graphic MMORPGs such as Everquest and Anarchy Online, but I've played probably 30 in total, trying to avoid the ones where PvP & the "clan" mentality had taken hold, rather than the generally friendly "guild" system is dominant (not to say guilds can't get nasty on occassion) But even in those worlds, this kind of reception for new players would be quickly slapped down by a few high-level self-appointed vigilantes. You don't pick on people who can't fend for themselves, any more than you beat kittens to death (although, I do remember a case where that was done in an animal shelter by teenagers in this country, and written off as "boys being boys")

Not a very pretty reflection on your community, is it?

(if you want a full listing of games, I'll give it - and Lisje IS my online name, one of which I am very proud, which is why she is never the first character I bring into a new world)

[Missy]

First of all, your replies are ooc, and characters tend to ignore that text because it has nothing to do with their IC lives. Characters don't know what a RPG is since they don't have computers lol.

Unlike Charps if you've ever played them, this is one game where OOC-ness is completely disliked. You'll have to have your character respond to that as if it's actually being imprisoned, rather than you misunderstanding what's going on. Your character should have no idea about a RPG or anything that it was speaking about. It's in a world of it's own. Your opinion doesn't matter to that town, your characters might however, if it explained it didn't know about the law?

Eventually you'll come to see that it's not like that in every town, nor are they necessarily being mean but rather enforcing the laws they have made for that community. It's not necessarily the players behind the characters, but the characters themselves that shoudl be seen as harsh, and your character that might see them AS harsh, so ranting on the forum wont cause a change in the way your character has been treated.

If your character is having a problem understanding why it was imprisoned, it might ask those that are in it's surrounding currently, if they know why you were.

I myself don't mean to sound mean, but that's basically how it is. Do you understand that at all? ^.~

And Cantr is quite unlike any other online game.

[Nixit]

Yeah, it's kind of tough luck to have your first character in that town though...

[Schme]

I have to say that people are exetremly unfriendly to new players, which is likely one of the reasons that most new players leave very soon after begining.

Not that they mean to be. Alot of people just do not initially understand what is going on, much to the frusteration of the veteran players.


But he's right. If you say things like that, the characters shall likely assume you are quite out of your mind.

[Lisje]

That's fine - I guess she simply dies and leaves them a corpse to clean up then. Its sad that they badly mistreat someone who might prove to be a powerful ally one day. Oddly, the character that spawned there is probably the closest of mine to fit into that type of community, usually a big-boned almost barbarian cleric/shaman/herbalist type. But the chance was arbitrarily denied.

If more pre-game info isn't available online, and you have no idea of who you are looking at in-game to even begin a conversation, most people will move onto something that is more intuitive. Even the player FAQ that states if you "point" at someone, then look you can get their name is inaccurate (I tried it)

There are ways to make allowances for new players who are more comfortable with learning the ropes themselves before commiting themselves to an arbitrary grouping, without attracting the PvP kiddies and beggars that show up in other games. I've seen many that have figured that out.

I believe you'll need to provide some type of haven for new players eventually, not many people are still around who remember text adventures, and your communities will simply die off... Maybe that's what you are seeking. But it does seem like you are still trying to BUILD a world here, not simply watch one as it withers.

[TatteredShoeLace]

Well you also spawned in hell, er- I mean Karnon Forest. But I learned that this game needs some time to learn to play, then it is a good time.

[Missy]

That's fine - I guess she simply dies and leaves them a corpse to clean up then. Its sad that they badly mistreat someone who might prove to be a powerful ally one day. Oddly, the character that spawned there is probably the closest of mine to fit into that type of community, usually a big-boned almost barbarian cleric/shaman/herbalist type. But the chance was arbitrarily denied.

If more pre-game info isn't available online, and you have no idea of who you are looking at in-game to even begin a conversation, most people will move onto something that is more intuitive. Even the player FAQ that states if you "point" at someone, then look you can get their name is inaccurate (I tried it)

There are ways to make allowances for new players who are more comfortable with learning the ropes themselves before commiting themselves to an arbitrary grouping, without attracting the PvP kiddies and beggars that show up in other games. I've seen many that have figured that out.

I believe you'll need to provide some type of haven for new players eventually, not many people are still around who remember text adventures, and your communities will simply die off... Maybe that's what you are seeking. But it does seem like you are still trying to BUILD a world here, not simply watch one as it withers.

As I said, Cantr's quite different. The type of situation you've encountered isn't the first time it's happened to someone, including myself.


Introducing yourself after being spawned is usually a good start as well as asking what you should do. Literally saying "Hello I'm ____. What is there to do around here?/ Am I allowed to farm?"They'll likely tell you to read the laws and state their own names as well. I do realize how maddening your situation is.

Might I suggest though that you create a new character and check out a different town? If you spawn in KF again, well that'll really suck lol. But at least now, you know you can leave and wont be locked up for that. LOL But I'd try til you at least had one somewhere that's not Karnon Forest. Really, it's not all like that.

[Talapus]

The game is alot of fun, but you just happened to land in the worst possible place for a new spawn to appear. Other characters (assuming Karnon Forest doesn't become a spawn trap for you) should have alot fewer of these types of problems, but the K isle is so war like that a newspawn can easily get swept away there.

[DylPickle]

Not the worst possible place... KF is a utopia compared to what one, certain place is becoming...

[Bran-Muffin]

The character probably wont die if you decide to wake it up, and write an In-Character note for the higher up's who had your character locked up if they by chance check the building your locked up in before the entire CANTR year it takes to starve a character.

If you are a good role player your character will understand the situation, and learn to like the community.

[kinvoya]

Just because your char got put in jail it's not the end of her world. Did you see the thread that's all about chars who did jailtime? You just keep playing in character and deal with the situations which arise. From the sounds of it your char read the hunting law but missed some other laws. It's always a good idea to read all the notes on the ground. Unless there are 20 bijillion of them, in which case you try to spot the ones that look like they might be laws.

Good luck. Don't quit. Cantr isn't a game you learn on day one.

Also, if there are even any other chars in that jail they probably aren't listening to what she says. The people who locked her up are outside and can't hear her.

[Bowser]

Whether we can remember it or not, we were all new at one time or another. There is a learning curve to the game. A newbie manual could be helpful except there are no real rules to write down, each community makes its own rules and laws. Some are more violent than others, some are more quick to lock people up, and some are generous beyond belief.

The only advice I would give you is to read all notes in each new town you visit. This will not guarantee your safety, some people are unreasonable. Just because you can start a wood collecting project or pick something off the ground, does not mean its a smart thing to do. No one expects you to be a "smart" player right off. It takes time. Hopefully you won't give up. hopefully your post on the forum was to find out more about the players and how to succeed and not scolding us because your player in down on her luck.

Dry those tears and find a way out of prison.

[west]

I'd like to make a slight "I told ya so" in regards to Karnon Forest becoming a miserable place, and also in regards to the need for a knowledge base.

[Jetlag]

I see a number of problems here, some of which are easy to address and some of which aren't.

Firstly, Karnon Forest is not the easiest place to get started, though it's by no means impossible. One of my characters is doing very well there. I don't think it's a bad thing that places like KF exist, because to some extent it's the challenge of fitting into or fighting a strong society that makes the game fun.

Secondly, it's impossible to tell the difference between a newspawn from a brand new player and a newspawn form a player who's already been through a dozen spawnings and knows what they're doing. There are clues once that character starts to interact/speak/do things, but they're not relaible. This tends to lead people to assume all newspawns at least have some idea what they're doing, because most of them do.

Thirdly, the interface gets some getting used to. I've said it before and I'll say it again, it would be really, really good if there was a "new player" guide that gave some help on how the interface works - it's stupid to accidentally hit another character just to find out what a certain button does, because your character isn't going to swing his fist to see what it does. If only I had time to write such a thing, I would.

Fourthly, I don't think the introduction really shows enough how the game works in terms of keeping OOC stuff out. When I first got involved, I read the description and expected something kind of similar to all the other so-called role play games out there on the internet, and it isn't at all. Perhaps a paragraph explaining in very simple terms why it's different would be good, and also explaining the CR.

Fifthly, it's difficult as a new player to know whether it's players or characters being mean. It's almost always characters, and I for one make a point of offering OOC pointers to people who seem to be new players (if players are mean in the game, then it's a Capital Rule Breach and they get a talking to or even a ban).


Have a think about what happened when you went in to Setanta Clan. You said nothing at all to the three people who were there, and you only stayed a few minutes. It looks like nobody happened to be awake, and I really don't think it's that surprising that they didn't bother to go talk to someone who didn't have the manners to introduce herself. I know my KF character is always very welcoming of people who introduce themselves.

As a free tip (because it's something I firmly believe your character should be able to see as obvious, but the interface isn't so intuitive) you could slip a note under the door by creating one, dropping it, and dragging it (which actually works more like pushing than dragging). That'll get a message to the outside because they won't hear you talking, but please be patient for a reply - it means someone else has to log on, check their character, read the note, discuss whats going on with someone in charge, who will then have to be logged on to answer, etc....it's a long, slow game, which is both Cantr's best and worst point.I hope you'll give it another go, Lisje.

[Bran-Muffin]

I'd like to make a slight "I told ya so" in regards to Karnon Forest becoming a miserable place, and also in regards to the need for a knowledge base.

You have absolutly no idea what you are talking about, so... dont talk about Blackrock(karnon)Forest.

It is no where near a miserable place to live, ten times better than when your weakling was running things.

One person who doesnt know how to play the game ends up getting locked up for breaking the law and suddenly its the worst place to live.