Cantr II Discussion Forum

ObsessedWithCats wrote:Maybe an optional setting on each transmitter to broadcast its location, and another setting on each receiver to not pick up messages which don't include the location?

I'm a bit stuck on how the radio would know where it is unless the person who builds or uses it tells it, in which case they could lie, but maybe we could use a longitude and latitude system (so you can only imitate someone in the same location, and you can head in the right direction to find trolls) which radios determine from magnetic fields of the Cantr-world's planet or something? Not very scientific, but just as logical as the ice-cream crank. People would get used to which co-ordinates are legit radio users, and be able to find anyone who broadcasts where they are and ignore anyone who doesn't.

Eww. No. Please no.

I remember a particular pirate attack where the pirates sent a radio message to try to throw off their two pursuers. That was interesting, and I think a legitimate perk to having radio anonymity. It didn't work, but only because the pursuers didn't have radio. My char waiting at home for news did, though.

I know I said before that just about any radio action could be justified as in character, even if it's a secret character trait of an otherwise upstanding citizen, but maybe in the case of purposeless radio trolling, the benefit of doubt shouldn't be distributed quite so leniently. I would be surprised if more than one or two players engaged in this sort of behavior. I'm sure a case could be made that these actions are deliberate attempts at disrupting regular game-play for others.

in the case of purposeless radio trolling

In this case, the proper way to solve the problem is to have characters (ids) using the radio documented in the database with the message they sent, -without- this info displayedd to the players themselves. It'd be behind the scenes. That way you could report trolling incidents (as long as it was actual trolling, I.E talking about RL celebs, or controversial RL politics just to piss people off, or whatever - things that absolutely aren't supposed to be in Cantr), with the message, time and date, and boom. Moderators know who it was, they take it from there, IC everyone ignores that message.
Problem solved.

Besides that, no. I don't agree people should know IC where messages are coming from. There are IC ways to determine if you are talking to the person you should be talking to, like asking things only they would know. If you or your character simply don't think to verify, that's not anyone else's fault, and I don't believe we should take away an interesting aspect of the game just because they don't verify for one reason or another.

I also don't wish to remove the anonymity of the radio system.

The major problems at hand seem to be that people "troll" using the radio system and that no one can 100% verify identities without implementing basic codes. These are both problems that can be solved in game and "fixing" them by implementing the above solutions would (in my opinion) make the radio unbalanced.

The "problems" the radio currently has seems to be caused by is an extremely high rate of adoption, as seen with the English zone possessing an inter-island radio network achieved even with the problems outlined earlier in the thread. Don't want random people (I'm not considering ooc trolling because that should be handled by PD) messing with legitimate communication? Separate your network, build a new one or come up with codes. The only thing these suggestions seem to accomplish is allowing for the continuance of a large, publicly accessible network with no oversight. If no one is even trying to fix the gaping security hole IC then why should Cantr's limited resources be reallocated to something that the player base seems to accept IC?

p.s I realize that individual towns do indeed regulate radio use but that hardly fixes the problems of the network as a whole

What about using secret frequencies or password phrases to identify a person, perhaps with a rotating scheme of code numbers? The radio system was partly designed to be somewhat anonymous, but to allow characters to invent tricks (hence the ability to change frequencies).

I mean, it should be possible to come up with in-game solutions, although I think it's also reasonable to have a device that is expensive to produce that measures some further details about the radio broadcast, like intensity (to assess distance) or perhaps direction.

I don't think any solution that sees pretending someone you are not as a breach of game rules would be good - not only because it's too much work for the PD, but also because being annoying should be a game playing option ...

But problems rise when you need to talk to strangers, for example to track down a criminal or to warn people of pirates. No one has any ingame means of figuring out which messages are legitimate in either end, but if someone pranks you repeatedly, in real world you would be able to recognize it's the same person.

Jos Elkink wrote:What about using secret frequencies[..]? The radio system was partly designed to be somewhat anonymous, but to allow characters to invent tricks (hence the ability to change frequencies).

People keep throwing this around as if it were a viable option for most people.

New frequencies are EXPENSIVE.

Different frequencies are hardly a viable option, except within small groups. Most radio contact isn't like that.

computaertist wrote:

Jos Elkink wrote:What about using secret frequencies[..]? The radio system was partly designed to be somewhat anonymous, but to allow characters to invent tricks (hence the ability to change frequencies).

People keep throwing this around as if it were a viable option for most people.

New frequencies are EXPENSIVE.

Over long distances, yeah. But, code words or verification questions are not expensive. I think I have to agree that, aside from not being able to recognize voices, it's realistic for people to have the option of being annoying over the radio, even if it might not always be realistic for the characters that take this option to have taken it... (my guess is that most radio impersonators impersonate for out-of-context reasons, like for their inexplicable joy in angering others, but this is unprovable)

computaertist wrote:

Jos Elkink wrote:What about using secret frequencies[..]? The radio system was partly designed to be somewhat anonymous, but to allow characters to invent tricks (hence the ability to change frequencies).

People keep throwing this around as if it were a viable option for most people.

New frequencies are EXPENSIVE.

Yeah, unless you're communicating directly with the other end, every relay inbetween will have to be changed also. The Treefeather/Cantr system only works on the 100, as far as I understand, and to recreate it for just one or two more frequencies would take at least a generation, probably.

also, ninjad

^^ This is why I was all for the suggestion of making radio repeaters either repeat on all frequencies, or a wider band of frequencies - like 100-199 or 200-299.

hyrle wrote:^^ This is why I was all for the suggestion of making radio repeaters either repeat on all frequencies, or a wider band of frequencies - like 100-199 or 200-299.

The bands of frequencies idea is good, and more realistic... and... may take some crap off the main frequency? Or is that just wishful thinking?

I think that if someone wants to troll or prank or whatever on the radio, then they are going to do it on the most popular frequency to annoy as many people as possible.

It may help with some of the drawn out "Hey, how are you doing?" conversations or some of the, "I'm bored and lonely, talk to me please?" conversations... But I think the biggest complaint to bring this whole thing up was the "trolls".

I wasn't thinking of it for the trolls, but more for the personal conversations that characters decide to have over the radio. It gets old fast to hear all the lovey dovey stuff over 100. Though I understand why characters would want to contact their loved ones far away.

I was guessing that there was never going to be a solution to the trolling. It can never be stopped, and Jos has spoken: it is there to be abused and manipulated by certain individuals.

But with the banded or universal repeaters, less private conversations on the main channel would mean less fuel for trolls... it could be a good solution..