CRB type questions

[bnlphan]

Maybe I should put this in support but don't want to bother those that are busy with other things so posting her for general discussion.

I have only made one offical request for investigation, but I admit it often arises to where I am suspicious in game of characters but I don't want to annoy staff if I can avoid it.
Some quesstion I have.

My characters avoid anything touched by any of my other characters If at all possible. Had to turn down a purchase of a vehicle one time because it once belonged to another of mine. I left resources in a town once by mistake. Had to watch them rot with another while I gathered the same resource with a different character. Am I being too strict on myself? I don't think so. If someone does something like these is P.D. notified automatically?

Is it okay to talk to one of your own characters on the radio? Answer a question just supplying information? Seems that would be a violation? Didn't I read that it is not permissable to drop notes like maps knowing one of your other characters would get it?

[Bmot]

-If- I'm right (and this is how I read the rules) it's important you aren't leaving things on purpose for another char of yours. It's a bit strict in that you can't have your own characters trade.

In my eyes (and please, correct me if I'm wrong) as long as you have good IG reasons, and it's what would happen if one of your chars was just a random other char, there's not much of a problem.

The thing with the resources you mentioned might be a bit hard to justify if you got asked about it. The thing with the car sounds, for me, like something that could've gone through...

[bnlphan]

Thanks BMot,

I figured I'm a bit stricter than the average player on how I treat my charries but I figure better safe than sorry. Maybe one of these days I'll catch a P.D. person in the irc and pick their brains. Until then I'll imagine mass emails and red lights flashing for them if one of my characters picks up some bones another one my characters left from killing an animal

I did think of another situation I wonder about. Terragotha Island. Wouldnt having two residents on that island be a violation since the governement is so organized and now especially with the trade loop going again. Very likely that one of your charries could gather resources that gets sent on the loop and used by another one of your charries? Violation of same organization rule?

I guess I could ramble about this stuff all day lol. Just curious and dont want to bother P.D. staff with hypothetical questions.

[Doug R.]

The policy regarding trading used to be that you need to give all the other characters in a location a chance to reply and conduct the trade before your character does. This could be a day or two, depending on how busy the town is. Once you conduct the trade, it needs to be fair, and you should notify the PD that you're doing it. Of course, the policy could have since changed. I think this could also apply to to the radio situation as well. An exchange of information is pretty much the same as an exchange of goods. However, understand that the radio reaches a wide audience, and there are players out there that will know you play both characters, whether you've outed them publicly or not, and as soon as they hear both of your characters chatting, will instanly assume impropriety. So, it's probably best to avoid talking to yourself on the radio, even if it's justified.

Teregotha: The rule regarding multi-town territories was that it was fine, so long as they lived in separate areas and didn't directly benefit one another. At least it used to be. Keep in mind that if a player does have two spawn in such a place, the newspawn can't leave the island in any practical way, so it's quite a bit of a stretch to force people to kill a character just because of spawning circumstance. Trade loops benefit the towns, not the characters directly, so I wouldn't think that's an issue. I would suggest, however, that it would be a very bad idea to have more than one of those characters involved in any way in town or island politics. As soon as you have two characters voicing the same opinion, it becomes a CRB. So, make one a quiet worker that doesn't care about politics.

Edit in blue

[bnlphan]

Thanks for the clarification Doug

[Estaar]

Teregotha: The rule regarding multi-town territories was that it was fine, so long as they lived in separate areas and didn't directly benefit one another. At least it used to be. Keep in mind that if a player does have two spawn in such a place, they physically can't leave the island, so it's quite a bit of a stretch to force people to kill a character just because of spawning circumstance. Trade loops benefit the towns, not the characters directly, so I wouldn't think that's an issue. I would suggest, however, that it would be a very bad idea to have more than one of those characters involved in any way in town or island politics. As soon as you have two characters voicing the same opinion, it becomes a CRB. So, make one a quiet worker that doesn't care about politics.

What if they voice opposing opinions?

[Auryn]

I once had a character walk into an abandoned building with the body of a previous character by accident. I had picked the roads completely by random and didn't recognize the building name until "oh wait this body here looks familiar..." He got out of town really quickly.

[Doug R.]

Teregotha: The rule regarding multi-town territories was that it was fine, so long as they lived in separate areas and didn't directly benefit one another. At least it used to be. Keep in mind that if a player does have two spawn in such a place, they physically can't leave the island, so it's quite a bit of a stretch to force people to kill a character just because of spawning circumstance. Trade loops benefit the towns, not the characters directly, so I wouldn't think that's an issue. I would suggest, however, that it would be a very bad idea to have more than one of those characters involved in any way in town or island politics. As soon as you have two characters voicing the same opinion, it becomes a CRB. So, make one a quiet worker that doesn't care about politics.

What if they voice opposing opinions?

Personally, I still wouldn't like it, and if I were PD, I'd probably ask the player to silence one of them. My reason for that is that you can still wind up helping your other character by attempting to advance the opposite position. You can't control the effects of words once you type them, so it's best to stay mum where your other character's interests are concerned. Figure out which character feels the most strongly on an issue, and stick to that character. Besides, why would you want to stymie your own character's efforts anyway? It's maddening enough when someone else thwarts you, but when you thwart yourself...?

[Marian]

I've never been in this situation myself, but I've had a close enough call once that I've often thought about it.

With the amount of kidnapping and slavery that goes on...or at least used to and I assume still does...what would be the best way to handle it if you had two characters brought to the same location against their will? You'd then have a very good IC reason (not wanting to be murdered!) to have then remain there, working for the same people, with those same people also being their enemies. Even if one of them went quiet and you were careful to only do anything with them hours apart, it seems like it could turn into a pretty sticky situation. Would you be expected to just let one of them die at that point?

Also I'm not sure I'm understanding the problem with some of the other examples brought up like buying a previously owned vehicle or coming across the corpse of a previous character well after their death...none of these involve you deliberately arranging for your characters to coordinate with each other for OOC reasons, so I don't see how they could be considered a CRB.

[Joshuamonkey]

When I was relatively new to Cantr I thought that it was okay to give something to another character if acting completely how the characters would with any character (like borrowing a tool). But I got in trouble for that so I learned to just never have characters directly trade or give things to each other. I had one of those characters move to another town a few towns away (actually a PD member told me to do so). And it was necessary for those two towns to trade, but I made sure to just send another character to handle the trade and not do it with my own character.
And I definitely wouldn't have my characters talk to each other by radio. I even try to avoid learning things as a player pertaining to my character on the radio through another character, because it's annoying not being able to use that information..Having characters communicate by radio I feel would make passing information between characters too easy.
So bnlphan you're doing a good job of following the rule.

[Doug R.]

I've never been in this situation myself, but I've had a close enough call once that I've often thought about it.

With the amount of kidnapping and slavery that goes on...or at least used to and I assume still does...what would be the best way to handle it if you had two characters brought to the same location against their will? You'd then have a very good IC reason (not wanting to be murdered!) to have then remain there, working for the same people, with those same people also being their enemies. Even if one of them went quiet and you were careful to only do anything with them hours apart, it seems like it could turn into a pretty sticky situation. Would you be expected to just let one of them die at that point?
.

Honestly, how this would be handled would probably depend entirely on the personality of the PD member that looked into the situation, and how gracefully and respectfully the player responded to any PD inquiries, and would be hotly debated within the department. Personally, I'd let the two characters even conspire to escape (but not harm their captor), considering that the player had nothing to do with forming the situation, but I suspect there's as many opinions on this as there are people to give them. That's why we have people enforcing the rules and not code.

[Pilot]

Jos has responded to these numerous times, for example here: viewtopic.php?p=338370#p338370

...I think the rule is quite clear and concise: your characters should be played as if they are controlled by different players, that do not know each other.

That is really the only rule.

Now to assist interpretation just slightly - but I think it distracts more than it helps, to be honest - you can follow the following rules of thumb:

• don't discuss in-game events within four days (to avoid the temptation of playing characters as they would if players knew each other);
• don't have two characters in one organisation (because it is really difficult to abide to the above rule when you do);
• don't have two characters reside in one town (same reason);
• don't have two characters work on one project or trade with each other (because it's very difficult to do this as if they... etc.)

But these are rules-of-thumb to help you as a player and to help the PD. They are not the capital rule.

So whenever you gain advantage because you control more than one character in the same region/organisation/town/story/event/etc., you are in breach of the rules.

The Players Department members are trained and have experience in guiding players into the fair game. If in doubt please write to players@cantr.net or contact any member of the team, listed here: memberlist.php?mode=group&g=5

Our efforts are aimed to clarify any particular situation to keep it fair for all.

[ManyVoices]

Jos Elkink wrote:
...I think the rule is quite clear and concise: your characters should be played as if they are controlled by different players, that do not know each other.

I wish the capital rule, truly was the capital rule, but it's not.

I once got investigated for a very small trade between two characters (like a days worth of goods). It was mutually beneficial, so I played them like they "should be played as if they are controlled by different players, that do not know each other". After proving my case, I was told it was ok, but I shouldn't do it. *shrugs* How is something ok, but I shouldn't do it?! I commend the players department for not disciplining me.

But, then it gets worse. I had two characters involved in a large island event "The Cassandra incident". Many, many characters were involved in this event. I know two of my characters were easily going to be involved so I started getting on IRC and spoke to some regarding how I am quickly going to have two characters in this mess. I was told to "put one to sleep". Well, that's stupid, the only reason my character would go to sleep is because I have another character involved, I'm not playing like my "characters should be played as if they are controlled by different players", I'm playing as if I control two characters in the same big event. I'm actually going against the capital rule by putting one to sleep. I basically had to OOC a fellow player letting them know I couldn't get involved due to player conflicts in spite of the fact that it was in the character's nature to get involved ... so much for my "characters should be played as if they are controlled by different players".

[computaertist]

I agree the thing that is claimed to be the capital rule IS NOT ANYTHING LIKE the real, enforced capital rule.

The REAL capital rule is "Avoid your characters sharing things, fights, and teamwork with your other own characters at all costs." Occasionally you can get around it by graciously explaining in detail why your characters are doing what your characters would do if they had nothing to do with you, because they are, but PD would prefer you didn't even try because it allows the possibility that you planned them getting together even if you didn't.

You get contacted over things like sharing notes about imaginary stuff like dreams that can't possibly give you any kind of actual advantage when you normally would have done that with anyone.

[Vega]

Jos Elkink wrote:
...I think the rule is quite clear and concise: your characters should be played as if they are controlled by different players, that do not know each other.

I wish the capital rule, truly was the capital rule, but it's not.

I once got investigated for a very small trade between two characters (like a days worth of goods). It was mutually beneficial, so I played them like they "should be played as if they are controlled by different players, that do not know each other". After proving my case, I was told it was ok, but I shouldn't do it. *shrugs* How is something ok, but I shouldn't do it?! I commend the players department for not disciplining me.

But, then it gets worse. I had two characters involved in a large island event "The Cassandra incident". Many, many characters were involved in this event. I know two of my characters were easily going to be involved so I started getting on IRC and spoke to some regarding how I am quickly going to have two characters in this mess. I was told to "put one to sleep". Well, that's stupid, the only reason my character would go to sleep is because I have another character involved, I'm not playing like my "characters should be played as if they are controlled by different players", I'm playing as if I control two characters in the same big event. I'm actually going against the capital rule by putting one to sleep. I basically had to OOC a fellow player letting them know I couldn't get involved due to player conflicts in spite of the fact that it was in the character's nature to get involved ... so much for my "characters should be played as if they are controlled by different players".

I think exactly the same. To me it feels more than going against the capital rule when I need to act against my chars than when I do what they will... You aren't supposed to change the behavior of your characters but suddenly one of the most wakeful chars of the town goes to sleep and your most nice and helpful chars turn into a not-so-nice one refusing to take travelers in its ship because you (ooc) know that if you are nice they'll finish dragging the asleep one to the second one's ship. (That was my first conflict in cantr... And it still feels so wrong...)