Restrict new signups to 18 years or older

[computaertist]

I haven't voted yet, not because I don't care but because I can't decide.

My concern with marking a multiplier game as adult only is that it may attract more people who are looking for places to do the things we'd be protecting minors from, and together may drag the tone of the game more aggressively in that direction. I haven't decided that's necessarily a bad thing, but my gut says it probably is.

[Sunni Daez]

I agree, if you make it a game for only over 18.. it will portray the intent of the game to be ..adult activities...

[cjace68]

Doug I love you, this is a brilliant idea. Most people who play Cantr are older anyway. Honestly, people act like this is a game minors take part in, but I think only a select few are. It really isn't marketed for minors.

[Faith]

Doug I love you, this is a brilliant idea. Most people who play Cantr are older anyway. Honestly, people act like this is a game minors take part in, but I think only a select few are. It really isn't marketed for minors.

Around the 10% of the players are minors. If they speak their own language, minors would be the third language group in number of players of the game.

[...] if you make it a game for only over 18.. it will portray the intent of the game to be ..adult activities...

And, mainly for this, I voted "no".

[Black Canyon]

Perhaps we should go with some kind of a rating system similar to other video games. I certainly don't want it implied that this is some sort of cyberfest, but it should be made clear that there are adult themes roleplayed in this game which may involve violence and sex and some offensive language.

[Swingerzetta]

I see in a lot of online games, disclaimers about how interactions with real people are not rated. (As if that's not obvious. Legal systems are so strange) Would this be helpful here?

[Faith]

I think that all of this depends in what game you want to play. I think that in Cantr there is already a lot of freedom; sexually speaking for example, you can play any kind of sex, you just need to ask to the other players if they agree (and even with only adults playing, this will remain).
What more things minors doesn't allow exactly in the game?
Offensive comunication by radio? Well, it was denounced by adult players too.

[Pilot]

This is not going to happen because:

This is a family friendly game.

To enforce this we would need to ask for a credit card as a way to verify the age of the players and we won't do that.

To force minors to lie about their age to play is irresponsible.

There are other games for adults you can also try without the need to change the target ages of players of this one.

And as an ex GAB member commented not long ago:

... limit Cantr to 18 and older, would destroy the game in both player loss and in attracting sex simmers...

As a last comment, what you see using 15 chars is a tiny part of Cantr World and there are many languages zones where responsible players know how to use their words to include player peers of any age in their gaming, and report to admins those who cross the line of gaming etiquette.

Moved to General Diuscussion since policy topics don't belong in suggestion forums

[bnlphan]

I agree with a lot of said. You start verifying age you are going to lose a lot of adult players who don't want to go through the trouble or a trust issue.

Personally it doesnt matter to me. I think a lot of the trouble in the game is caused by young players. Or at least very immature.

Too bad we cant just designate an 18 and under island and all under 18's spawn there and only there and can't leave until they are over 18. Anyone can play there as long that they agree children are present, but Im guessing that's a programming night mare.

[Black Canyon]

This is not going to happen because:

This is a family friendly game.

To enforce this we would need to ask for a credit card as a way to verify the age of the players and we won't do that.

To force minors to lie about their age to play is irresponsible.

There are other games for adults you can also try without the need to change the target ages of players of this one.

And as an ex GAB member commented not long ago:

... limit Cantr to 18 and older, would destroy the game in both player loss and in attracting sex simmers...

As a last comment, what you see using 15 chars is a tiny part of Cantr World and there are many languages zones where responsible players know how to use their words to include player peers of any age in their gaming, and report to admins those who cross the line of gaming etiquette.

Moved to General Diuscussion since policy topics don't belong in suggestion forums

Not sure I agree with any of this. Where is it written that Cantr is a family friendly game? And since when is it required to provide a credit card to verify age.... and how would providing a credit card verify age anyway? To imply that by making this change we'd be "forcing" minors to lie is absurd.

I'm also not convinced that it would destroy the game to make this change, but I don't feel strongly enough about it either way to battle over it.

[cjace68]

The more I think about it, it isn't a good idea to restrict the signups to 18 years or older. I'm changing my vote. However...I would advocate 16 years or older. No verification would be necessary, but if we put a warning up, at the very least, it would deter some kids away.

[Swingerzetta]

I think that all of this depends in what game you want to play. I think that in Cantr there is already a lot of freedom; sexually speaking for example, you can play any kind of sex, you just need to ask to the other players if they agree (and even with only adults playing, this will remain).
What more things minors doesn't allow exactly in the game?
Offensive comunication by radio? Well, it was denounced by adult players too.

This, and the point that o it'll promote adult activities, rather than just allowing them, are points. My guy reaction was to say yeah! who needs young people! except the intelligent, mature one who have a basic grasp of punctuation and understand three purpose and meaning of roleplay. But now I realize that it would basically have no effect on my Cantr experience, and I expect I'm not alone.

[saztronic]

Where is it written that Cantr is a family friendly game? And since when is it required to provide a credit card to verify age.... and how would providing a credit card verify age anyway? To imply that by making this change we'd be "forcing" minors to lie is absurd.

I'm also not convinced that it would destroy the game to make this change, but I don't feel strongly enough about it either way to battle over it.

I think it was a suggestion to *add* credit card verification to sign-up, as a way of verifying age. And I think the idea behind that, is that you can't have a credit card of your own unless you are 18 or older... which is why so many adult sites have used that method in the past as a way of verifying age and limiting liability. Of course young people are clever and can get around this.

Personally, I'm torn on this one (although I voted for it). As the parent of young and not-so-young children, I am mindful of Doug's reminder that legally speaking (and I would argue, possibly, morally speaking to some extent) people under the age of 18 are not actually able to consent to explicit sexual exchanges with adults. So even if you ask OOC, and an underage person lies and says they are of age, you may have some argument that whatever happens subsequently is OK, but it's a bit of a legal gray area. If that happened in RL you'd still be committing a felony. The differences online are the greater anonymity and the absence of any physical contact.

Also, as a parent who has, at times, engaged in explicit activity in the game, it just skeeves me out to think my kids might play it someday, or at least play it at the same time as I do. I also had a sibling who played the game in the past, and true to CR did not know who my sibling's characters were, so have had to think about this before as well. I'm no prude, but still, yuck.

On the other hand, I think any adult playing this game, abiding assiduously by the rule of asking OOC for consent, ought for the most part to be OK. I don't care if it bothers you to go OOC, or you find it annoying, or think it detracts from the RP experience, or whatever. In RL people complain similarly about condoms, but if you're not mature and self-aware enough to use condoms when they're called for, then you are probably not mature enough and self-aware enough to be engaging in sexual activity in the first place. I think of the "no minors and ask for consent rules" as being like a prophylactic for the soul, I suppose, and as such, the only safe activity in game is activity that includes that OOC element.

But I'm also no lawyer... does Cantr have one to consult? Because the law really is the bottom line here for the game... everything else that's being discussed in this thread is just personal opinions and feelings. It certainly should not be left open to a poll... it's not a matter for democratic decision making, it's a matter for legal experts.

[Reaction]

While I can see how setting up age restrictions would be convenient, I'm voting no. I've played this game for the better part of ten years, and started as a minor. I can easily think of several players that I met through the irc at the time who were also minors, and great contributors to the game.

I'm not so active in the community now as I was at the time, but I imagine there must still be a considerable number of minors who are doing cantr proud.

Aside from the legal implications, I do not see any reason to consider banning minors. Adults are often just as guilty of immaturity.

A bit of an afterthought here; under which country's legal system would these hypothetical policies have to adhere to?

[SekoETC]

One problem is that since the game is so anonymous, it's hard to know if someone is a minor unless you're about to have sex with their character and then it's already an awkward situation.

I'm against requiring credit card verification because even though in the States it might be easy to get a credit card, in Finland you can only get a credit card if you have solid income and if you're unemployed, you don't qualify. I'm okay with having a disclaimer and a button that says I'm mature enough to handle this.