Repair Project Revision

[Yang]

With this change tool rot all the time. It didn't rot because there was a problem in game. This change is to fix it. Putting to repair for ages to prevent it from rotting was just exploit that is now removed. Maybe this is main problem with this change? Some people like to have useful bug.

[Sunni Daez]

I wouldn't call it a bug by any means... and in some places, repairing tools is far from a priority, and building up the number of people in your area is so far from impossible.. I , for one, do not like this change.


Right now, some of my people.. in the lower population areas, are fighting to stay alive from these animal attacks.. so trying to keep tools from rotting and keep healing foods gathered and prepared.. Nutrition foods supplied.. they don't have time to develop a life.. and will eventually grow bored with them, slowly stop RP at all, how much can you RP about tool repair and animal bites?

[Yang]

I don't know how much you can RP about it, but i can tell you that you can complain about it a lot. I have few characters that live in dangerous places and i say its way too easy to develop there. Also rotting items is so slow, that few hours for repair once for 20 years is also not a big problem Example: hammer rot 7 per day and repair 1500 for hour, so one hour of repair for 10 years of rotting. Only problem is that, when you find abandoned village you wont find there tools as they rot away. How long it takes? 50-100 years? I dont know what is maximum for it before it break in to dust.
Producing healing food? Do you have hive? Then is so simple to do so. Just get some water from well, and make Earthenware window box and start growing some herbs, that you put in hive and you have honey that is quite good healing food. If you grow basil then from one day of work at well you can make 1680 grams of honey that can heal 50% of health. To make such damages person cant have shield, or be hit few times. But growing herb and making honey is automatic, so only work you make is getting water. If you use solar still then absolutely no work is needed to get free honey.

As you can see, all those problems are so simple to solve that they should never be used again versus improvements in game.

[Sunni Daez]

yea.. to make a hive you need bees wax.. to make pots you need clay, to get water you need a well or pump ... and all these things take items too. it isn't as easy as you are trying to make it sound. Some have no choice about where they are..and no benefit of the things already built, A solar still produces water at such a slow rate, you could never get enough "free" honey to keep up..


..and I have been hit, holding an iron shield and taking 15 to 20% damage.. and they hit every hour (random, yes but..potentially, if I cannot play for a day.. I return to a dead charri..

It doesn't matter if I argue my points. My points are ~ not~ the ones that matter

as for the RP.. sure .. you can complain about those things, ((RP)) but that gets just as old, just as fast...

I returned to Cantr with a new attitude but.. it is a game.. and it seems to be getting less and less of a place to RP.

[Mr. Bones]

..and I have been hit, holding an iron shield and taking 15 to 20% damage.. and they hit every hour (random, yes but..potentially, if I cannot play for a day.. I return to a dead charri..

ha, I used to have the same problem. The trick is to hunt every animal everyday, on those wild islands that's about ten or more animals, within a decade of life your character will be an expert hunter regardless of current skill.

[Yang]

Sure you need some items first before you can start producing honey. But if newspawns could make all in empty places then what for we should play? I like the challenge in game, but its hard to find it, when you can live in place without food, or wood, alone, with many wild aggressive animals and still its not a big challenge to start civilization there. Maybe animals start being more aggressive now, but still not sure if its enough to create problem.

As for solar still production. Its quite cheap, so if you have more boats you can place on every one and this production is decent. Make four of them and you have enough water for one pot, that create enough herb for hive. So this way you can make 180 grams of honey per day for free. Absolutely no work needed to keep this production. If you set up 80 days project then you can leave this for 4 years all alone. Just be patient.

[Greek]

I wouldn't call it a bug by any means.

You are right. Bugs which are old and profitable for everyone should be called features.

I don't get where is the problem in this change (except of removing one very nice feature).
As was already said, if you used to setup repairs and go away then you'll be able to setup them the same way by just explicitely dropping items after project setup. It's more clicking, but it's impossible to make a decision without wasting clicks to inform the game what do you want to do. And it can be done by clicking drop buttons one after another on the inventory page, so it won't take much time.
Currently objects are disappearing and reappearing when project is finished, so they still can be stolen. Dropping is done implicitly so it's possible to start repair of battle axe, forget about it and make it drop on the ground when finished by somebody else. Now it won't be possible to start repair of weapon and be stuck by it when you have to run away.
I don't know why to create repair projects in different location than you. So I don't know how much newspawns do you have to set projects for them with no hope to find somebody reliable enough to make him/her responsible for all these tools, which solves all problems in both current and future system. If this change encourages people to have specific profession then I think it's good.

Right now, some of my people.. in the lower population areas, are fighting to stay alive from these animal attacks..

There was some time since September to remove most aggressive animals and control them before wild predators ceased to be pets with free meat.

random, yes but..potentially, if I cannot play for a day.. I return to a dead charri..

Near death state was introduced to make such situations impossible. Somebody else can save you easily, unless you live alone. It should be quite challenging to play a hermit in the middle of the wild jungle, so I think it's fine.

I've inspected warehouse of one of Zlotnik's characters and a half-time expert tool master would be enough to do repairs, despite of having probably much more tools than needed for a small town.
But this change doesn't touch repair time, so it shouldn't be a problem. Unless you were clever and used a feature to have much more tools than you should be able to maintain.

Objects stored in container aren't considered as near. No matter if container has lock or no. Maybe it will be changed if this code will be used somewhere else where such behavior would be required. But now it isn't and doesn't make much sense (especially when it goes to locks).

Discussion about honey

No off-topic, please!

[Marian]

Yang, I don't want to start an argument here (the way you're phrasing a few of the things you're posting sounds a little rude but I'm going to assume it's a language problem and not intentional) but honestly, you keep just saying we don't "get" things, but it's hard for me to believe you seriously can't see at all that this is a pretty huge change and likely to cause difficulties....even Doug admits that and apparently this project is his baby.

Unless your chars all live in these amazing towns where so many trustworthy, reliable people are just coming out of the woodwork that you can both spare and convince them to just stand around 'supervising' repairs for half their lives...in which case I want to know where these places are so I can start heading mine there right away, CRB be damned.

There is a big difference to me between having a risk of a steel battle axe maybe being on the ground for an hour or two, and having that steel battleaxe, two claymores, half a dozen iron shields, and the town's entire set of blacksmithing tools all either laying out for a week or so begging any random newspawn to steal them, or else being held by the designated 'stand around the workshop and be bored' person who could just as easily fall asleep with the whole set.

Still, I'm not as much against the whole thing as I probably sounded before...I was just kind of in shock when I first read the notice posted and hoping I'd understood that particular part wrong, it was a huge change that for me at least came pretty much out of nowhere and it's really going to screw things up for at least one of my characters, but I can see why it's needed if it's necessary for other changes, and I guess I'll just have to figure out a way to work around it.

And being able to cancel repairs (and to a lesser degree, being able to use a tool while it's being repaired even if that doesn't make much sense from a realism standpoint) will be helpful at least.

[Sunni Daez]

Fault can be found in every statement made..

justifications can always be made..

Things are never as easy in game as they sound on paper...

Does a tool in storage rot at the same rate as a tool in use? Before, setting a tool in repair.. at least to me.. was like putting it away.. it isn't used, the rot rate should be like next to nothing..

Using a tool.. one left out.. yes.. a higher rot rate should apply.. so this is why I say it isn't a bug... thanks for the sarcasm.

[Doug R.]

even Doug admits that and apparently this project is his baby.

Oh, I have nothing to do with this, but I really, really, really want to be able to add custom descriptions to my character's items, so this is a must for me. I think that ability is a role-play enhancement x1000, and easily offsets any difficulties.

[Oasis]

My only problem with this new system is having people working on repairs, and mine has to run inside quickly and come back out, and anyone working on those repairs no longer will be. If their participation could automatically resume, that would solve my problem. If it can't, I will always hate this and think it not a good trade off to be able to put a name on a hammer. Is there no other way to be able to name a hammer?

[freiana]

To me this just means every town that wants to put newspawns on repair jobs will need a trusted repair overseer... Which isn't actually all that weird to me.

[HFrance]

Of two things: either modify the whole roleplay of labor relations done until today or changes the definition of Cantr as a slow paced game.

[freiana]

...either modify the whole roleplay of labor relations done until today....

This is really not as dramatic as everyone thinks of it, doable by players themselves in game, and definitely more real... You actually just need one person to overlook the work to make sure your newspawn worker doesn't just put something in his pocket.

[HFrance]

I have a better idea. Attack workers until they are half their health and lock them in a room.