Characters and Personality Typing

General out-of-character discussion among players of Cantr II.

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Snickie
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Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Snickie » Fri May 27, 2016 6:16 am

So I've been obsessed with various typology systems in the past few months, which in part accounts for my absence on Cantr. What I haven't done to that end is type my own characters using my newfound knowledge.

Way back when, I used to type my characters using MBTI dichotomies. I'm pretty sure some of those were wrong by the cognitive functions methods, so I will be retyping them.
Furthermore, I will be using enneagram as well, a system I was not aware of before but obviously am now.

Me: mostly likely INTP, possibly ISTP, 594 sp/so

Three
MBTI: a slightly unhealthy ISTJ (Si-Te-Fi-Ne)
Enneagram: 3w4 5w6 9w1 so/sp

Four
MBTI: INFP (Fi-Ne-Si-Te)
Enneagram: 9w1 4w5 5w6 so

Nine
MBTI: ISFJ (Si-Fe-Ti-Ne) or INFJ (Ni-Fe-Ti-Se)
Enneagram: 4w5 9w1 5w4 sp/so

Fourteen
MBTI: ESTP (Se-Ti-Fe-Ni) or ESFP (Se-Fi-Te-Ni)
Enneagram: 7w8 4w3 9w8


Feel free to type your own characters, or to type others'! Or yourselves, 'cause why not! :mrgreen:
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Alutka » Fri May 27, 2016 8:56 am

Snickie wrote:Feel free to type your own characters, or to type others'! Or yourselves, 'cause why not! :mrgreen:


Huh, I would if I had any idea what you are talking about! :shock: Do you have any compendium for nerds?
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Rebma » Fri May 27, 2016 9:36 am

I know myself I'm an ENFP (edit: assertive) and apparently 2w1. I don't know why you have so many xD my test only gave me 1 did I do it wrong? A lot of my categories were almost dead even. But it was a sample lol and didn't seem to have as many questions as the Myers Briggs usually does???. I'd never heard of Enneagram before today lol.

I'd like to do these for my characters. Maybe you have a better typing site?
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Snickie » Fri May 27, 2016 5:21 pm

Lol well, cognitive functions is different from dichotomies. People assume with dichotomies that, because they score one way, they can't possibly use the other way. Just because I score ISTP on most Myers-Briggs personality tests doesn't mean I can't use N or F at all ever. (In fact, I'm arguably actually INTP, and a possible Ti-Si loop might be why I usually score S, but that's another story.)

The most common misconception lies in the j/p axis. For example, people with J can be procrastinators and there are people with P that love adhering to schedules. Similarly, just because you're an I doesn't mean you're a recluse who would rather spend their days holed up in their room than engage in any social contact with another human ever, and not all E types are party animals.

The point of the cognitive function stack is that everyone uses every letter to some degree, and the 4-letter code shows orientation and preference. Your type (and code) is determined by your functional pair.

ENFP, for example:

Dominant Ne (extraverted iNtuition) (ENxP)
So what you're REALLY saying, even though you're disguising it behind bulls***, is this. Do you want to know what writing desks and ravens have in common? Are you sure this is the right decision? Because I have five other possible interpretations, and it would be a shame not to consider them all. I simply know how this works, and what you are really up to. Let's talk about ideas! I want to tell you mine and hear yours! I know this idea doesn't seem related to our discussion, but I think it ties in. I can sum up our concept in a metaphor. I can think of five different things at once! I can pick up your facial expressions and accent without even thinking about it. Let me tell you a story...

Ne is dominant. iNtuition is a perceiving function, and since it's extraverted, that makes your letter a P. Since it's dominant, that makes you E. So ENxP.

Auxiliary Fi (introverted Feeling) (ExFP)
I am happiest when staying true to what I believe and what I want for my life. I know what I want, what beliefs and ideals motivate me, and how I feel about something. This is good, and that is bad. I know you’re only pretending, because I can see right through you. How does this new belief measure up against my life, my goals, and my core values? I believe no one should enforce morality; it should be a conscious choice we make. I care very much about you. I am loyal to you. I have great enthusiasm and many feelings toward you, but I show it through actions rather than words. You don’t have to say anything for me to be able to connect to and understand your meaning. I am okay with silent affection.

Since your dominant function is an extraverted perceiving function (Pe for short), your auxiliary function has to be an introverted judging function (Ji for short) (Ti or Fi). In your case it's Fi.

Your dominant and auxiliary functions make up your functional pair. ENFP.

Tertiary Te (extraverted Thinking) (ExFP)
Look, I organized all my movies by alphabetical order or time period! My socks are sorted by colors or fabrics. I enjoy having things organized, but have to focus to set up the system. I know this isn’t working right, and I want to fix it. I suspect this project will take me another couple of hours, but I’m going to give myself extra time just in case. Look, either you can prove aliens exist or you can’t, and if you can’t, they probably don’t exist. Let’s talk about this idea to see if it’s even possible, on a factual level. This is why I made my decision. I want to have a plan and follow through with it, but sometimes I forget what time it is or what the steps in the plan were. I probably shouldn’t improvise answers as much.

The tertiary function is always the opposite of the auxiliary function. Te is opposite to Fi. You cannot have Fi without Te.

Inferior Si (introverted sensing) (ENxP)
I haven’t the faintest idea where that paper went. I had it five minutes ago. No, I didn’t remember that it’s your birthday… but I wanted to remember! I did a bunch of research on the Tudor period, but I need to dig up my notes for the details. I don’t want to talk about the past; it hurts too much. Show me how you did it, and then I’ll try it. I’m not a big fan of Christmas family gatherings, but I kind of miss the wonder of Christmas as a child. Don’t tell anyone, but sometimes I long for a normal life and a white picket fence. How… how did I remember the name of that fictional character in the cartoon I used to watch when I was a kid? That’s random!

Similarly, the inferior function is always the opposite of your dominant function. Si is opposite to Ne. You cannot have Ne without Si.

Quotes taken from http://funkymbtifiction.tumblr.com/cognitivefunctions and direct links from that page.

-=-=-=-=-

Me, I'm most likely INTP:
Dominant Ti - Introverted Thinking is a judging function and is what I lead with, thus making me IxTP.
Auxiliary Ne - With Ji as a dominant function, my auxiliary function must be Pe. The Pe function in my functional pair makes me a P even though I lead with Ji. I am fairly proficient with this function, though I can sometimes skip it.
Tertiary Si - Since I have Ne, I must also have Si. I use it well enough, though I sometimes tend to favor it over my auxiliary since it's oriented the same way as my dominant.
Inferior Fe - Since I have Ti, I must also have Fe. I don't use this very well.

While these might not exactly describe the way you judge and perceive things, they're a good starting point. It's also difficult to use these to type since these take the function itself and isolate it while in reality the functions interact with each other - Ne in an ENFP might look different than Ne in an ENTP because of the Fi vs Ti filter. There are also more concepts like looping (ignoring your auxiliary function in favor of your tertiary function because your dominant and tertiary functions are oriented the same way and thus feel better to use, can be healthy but sometimes not) and gripping (allowing the underdeveloped inferior function to take the wheel and make you act like an unhealthy version of the other type, in your case an unhealthy ISTJ) and shadow functions (the four functions not in your stack, and there are a bajillion theories on these).

It's up to you to decide how deep you want to dive in and understand your characters. And yourself.


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-


Enneagram is its own thing (although there are correlations between some types and some MBTI types). It deals with motivations and takes upbringing into account. I can explain the basic structure of the enneagram:

HEART TYPES: 2, 3, 4. Motivation: shame
HEAD TYPES: 5, 6, 7. Motivation: fear
GUT TYPES: 8, 9, 1. Motivation: anger

Each person has one within each of the types within their tritype (that's the three numbers, the 594 of mine). My head type, which I also lead with, is 5. My gut type is 9. My heart type is 4. Rebma appears to lead with a heart type: 2. If I had to guess, she might also use 7 and 1, making her tritype 271

WINGS
The characteristics of a type can vary and they often take on traits of one of the neighboring types, called a wing. For example, my middle number 9 is actually a 9w1. This means that, while I display many of the characteristics of a 9, I also display some characters of a 1 through the lens of 9, moreso than 8. Thus I have 9 with a 1 wing. It's sometimes difficult to distinguish which one is the base and which one is the wing (ex: I had a hard time deciding between 1w9 and 9w1) if they're both within the same type (9 and 1 are both gut types).
Me; 5 balanced (I don't know the shorthand notation for this), 9w1, 4w5

INSTINCTUAL VARIANT
sp - self-preservation, the concern of one's own safety, usually stereotyped to be the most reclusive of the three
sx - sexual, a focus on interpersonal relationships, usually stereotyped to be the most intense of the three
so - social, a focus on standings within larger societal groups


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Some sources.
Enneagram Institute - Learning the Enneagram
Free Enneagram Tests
FunkyMBTIFiction's Introduction to MBTI Cognitive Functions, contains helpful links
MBTI-Notes Tumblr blog, has good resources
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Undine » Fri May 27, 2016 5:59 pm

Ooh I love this idea! I recently took the official MBTI for a student leadership group, but have taken a free version of the test before that. Both results gave me INFJ (the rarest type, I believe!). I'm going to take the free test again but in the perspective of some of my favorite characters that I'm willing to name, to see how they score. I'm using this test.

Hamaon Pride: ENFP-Assertive
"The ENFP personality is a true free spirit. They are often the life of the party, but unlike Explorers, they are less interested in the sheer excitement and pleasure of the moment than they are in enjoying the social and emotional connections they make with others. Charming, independent, energetic and compassionate, the 7% of the population that they comprise can certainly be felt in any crowd." - Right on the money with this one. I modeled Hamaon off of the type of person that I used to want to be.

Kenja Nightshade: ISTJ-Assertive
"The ISTJ personality type is thought to be the most abundant, making up around 13% of the population. Their defining characteristics of integrity, practical logic and tireless dedication to duty make ISTJs a vital core to many families, as well as organizations that uphold traditions, rules and standards, such as law offices, regulatory bodies and military... ISTJs don't make many assumptions, preferring instead to analyze their surroundings, check their facts and arrive at practical courses of action. ISTJ personalities are no-nonsense, and when they've made a decision, they will relay the facts necessary to achieve their goal, expecting others to grasp the situation immediately and take action." - Definitely Kenja, or at least a part of herself. I would say that this is the "danger zone" Kenja.

This was actually a really cool experience. It forced me to make decisions on behalf of my characters, effectively "refining" their personality in my head. I can definitely say that they are individual people now, separate from myself. I think this would be great to do any time I create a character!
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Vega » Fri May 27, 2016 8:26 pm

I still don't get some of that stuff...
But I made Undine's test (it was the easiest) for some chars:

My youngest:
COMMANDER (ENTJ-T)
"ENTJs are natural-born leaders. People with this personality type embody the gifts of charisma and confidence, and project authority in a way that draws crowds together behind a common goal. ENTJs are characterized by an often ruthless level of rationality, using their drive, determination and sharp minds to achieve whatever end they've set for themselves....
If there's anything ENTJs love, it's a good challenge, big or small, and they firmly believe that given enough time and resources, they can achieve any goal. This quality makes people with the ENTJ personality type brilliant entrepreneurs, and their ability to think strategically and hold a long-term focus while executing each step of their plans with determination and precision makes them powerful business leaders. This determination is often a self-fulfilling prophecy, as ENTJs push their goals through with sheer willpower where others might give up and move on, and their Extroverted (E) nature means they are likely to push everyone else right along with them, achieving spectacular results in the process."

Give her a goal, and she'll conquer the world!!! "We" knew she was good :P

My oldest:
CAMPAIGNER (ENFP-T)
"The ENFP personality is a true free spirit. They are often the life of the party, but unlike Explorers, they are less interested in the sheer excitement and pleasure of the moment than they are in enjoying the social and emotional connections they make with others. Charming, independent, energetic and compassionate. "

Feels so true!
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Joshuamonkey » Fri May 27, 2016 8:49 pm

This site is great for understanding the different types http://www.typeinmind.com/fise/ (click on the personality you're looking for on the left).

Undine wrote:Both results gave me INFJ (the rarest type, I believe!).

I have a close friend who's INFJ, and she's one of the the most good hearted and serving people I know, yet can get overwhelmed with all the friends she makes (which is part of the personality), seeming more extroverted than she is.
And as an extroverted yet also introverted ENFJ I relate to INFJ in some ways, though not as much. Also we took the same test that you linked to.

I know it's not recommended but my characters all have the same personality as I do. I've tried some different things but I guess because of the personality I have it's hard to avoid. But all but one (now) of my characters are very old, so they are very much defined by their experiences, where they've lived, and who they've known. They also have different goals, but in many ways they do think alike (and as much as you try I argue that it's not possible (or at least it's rarely done) to completely eliminate your personality or mannerisms from your characters, though you can in some ways).
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Undine » Fri May 27, 2016 9:03 pm

Joshuamonkey wrote:I have a close friend who's INFJ, and she's one of the the most good hearted and serving people I know, yet can get overwhelmed with all the friends she makes (which is part of the personality), seeming more extroverted than she is.

Yes, this exactly! We're cursed with this strange middle ground between introvert and extrovert. I'm definitely introverted at heart, but last semester at school someone emailed me and asked me if I wanted to MC a talent show because I "seem like such an outgoing person!" I hope she knows that she isn't alone haha
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Rebma » Fri May 27, 2016 9:33 pm

Snickie wrote:Lol well, cognitive functions is different from dichotomies. People assume with dichotomies that, because they score one way, they can't possibly use the other way. Just because I score ISTP on most Myers-Briggs personality tests doesn't mean I can't use N or F at all ever. (In fact, I'm arguably actually INTP, and a possible Ti-Si loop might be why I usually score S, but that's another story.)

The most common misconception lies in the j/p axis. For example, people with J can be procrastinators and there are people with P that love adhering to schedules. Similarly, just because you're an I doesn't mean you're a recluse who would rather spend their days holed up in their room than engage in any social contact with another human ever, and not all E types are party animals.

The point of the cognitive function stack is that everyone uses every letter to some degree, and the 4-letter code shows orientation and preference. Your type (and code) is determined by your functional pair.

ENFP, for example:

Dominant Ne (extraverted iNtuition) (ENxP)
So what you're REALLY saying, even though you're disguising it behind bulls***, is this. Do you want to know what writing desks and ravens have in common? Are you sure this is the right decision? Because I have five other possible interpretations, and it would be a shame not to consider them all. I simply know how this works, and what you are really up to. Let's talk about ideas! I want to tell you mine and hear yours! I know this idea doesn't seem related to our discussion, but I think it ties in. I can sum up our concept in a metaphor. I can think of five different things at once! I can pick up your facial expressions and accent without even thinking about it. Let me tell you a story...

Ne is dominant. iNtuition is a perceiving function, and since it's extraverted, that makes your letter a P. Since it's dominant, that makes you E. So ENxP.

Auxiliary Fi (introverted Feeling) (ExFP)
I am happiest when staying true to what I believe and what I want for my life. I know what I want, what beliefs and ideals motivate me, and how I feel about something. This is good, and that is bad. I know you’re only pretending, because I can see right through you. How does this new belief measure up against my life, my goals, and my core values? I believe no one should enforce morality; it should be a conscious choice we make. I care very much about you. I am loyal to you. I have great enthusiasm and many feelings toward you, but I show it through actions rather than words. You don’t have to say anything for me to be able to connect to and understand your meaning. I am okay with silent affection.

Since your dominant function is an extraverted perceiving function (Pe for short), your auxiliary function has to be an introverted judging function (Ji for short) (Ti or Fi). In your case it's Fi.

Your dominant and auxiliary functions make up your functional pair. ENFP.

Tertiary Te (extraverted Thinking) (ExFP)
Look, I organized all my movies by alphabetical order or time period! My socks are sorted by colors or fabrics. I enjoy having things organized, but have to focus to set up the system. I know this isn’t working right, and I want to fix it. I suspect this project will take me another couple of hours, but I’m going to give myself extra time just in case. Look, either you can prove aliens exist or you can’t, and if you can’t, they probably don’t exist. Let’s talk about this idea to see if it’s even possible, on a factual level. This is why I made my decision. I want to have a plan and follow through with it, but sometimes I forget what time it is or what the steps in the plan were. I probably shouldn’t improvise answers as much.

The tertiary function is always the opposite of the auxiliary function. Te is opposite to Fi. You cannot have Fi without Te.

Inferior Si (introverted sensing) (ENxP)
I haven’t the faintest idea where that paper went. I had it five minutes ago. No, I didn’t remember that it’s your birthday… but I wanted to remember! I did a bunch of research on the Tudor period, but I need to dig up my notes for the details. I don’t want to talk about the past; it hurts too much. Show me how you did it, and then I’ll try it. I’m not a big fan of Christmas family gatherings, but I kind of miss the wonder of Christmas as a child. Don’t tell anyone, but sometimes I long for a normal life and a white picket fence. How… how did I remember the name of that fictional character in the cartoon I used to watch when I was a kid? That’s random!

Similarly, the inferior function is always the opposite of your dominant function. Si is opposite to Ne. You cannot have Ne without Si.

Quotes taken from http://funkymbtifiction.tumblr.com/cognitivefunctions and direct links from that page.

-=-=-=-=-

Me, I'm most likely INTP:
Dominant Ti - Introverted Thinking is a judging function and is what I lead with, thus making me IxTP.
Auxiliary Ne - With Ji as a dominant function, my auxiliary function must be Pe. The Pe function in my functional pair makes me a P even though I lead with Ji. I am fairly proficient with this function, though I can sometimes skip it.
Tertiary Si - Since I have Ne, I must also have Si. I use it well enough, though I sometimes tend to favor it over my auxiliary since it's oriented the same way as my dominant.
Inferior Fe - Since I have Ti, I must also have Fe. I don't use this very well.

While these might not exactly describe the way you judge and perceive things, they're a good starting point. It's also difficult to use these to type since these take the function itself and isolate it while in reality the functions interact with each other - Ne in an ENFP might look different than Ne in an ENTP because of the Fi vs Ti filter. There are also more concepts like looping (ignoring your auxiliary function in favor of your tertiary function because your dominant and tertiary functions are oriented the same way and thus feel better to use, can be healthy but sometimes not) and gripping (allowing the underdeveloped inferior function to take the wheel and make you act like an unhealthy version of the other type, in your case an unhealthy ISTJ) and shadow functions (the four functions not in your stack, and there are a bajillion theories on these).

It's up to you to decide how deep you want to dive in and understand your characters. And yourself.


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-


Enneagram is its own thing (although there are correlations between some types and some MBTI types). It deals with motivations and takes upbringing into account. I can explain the basic structure of the enneagram:

HEART TYPES: 2, 3, 4. Motivation: shame
HEAD TYPES: 5, 6, 7. Motivation: fear
GUT TYPES: 8, 9, 1. Motivation: anger

Each person has one within each of the types within their tritype (that's the three numbers, the 594 of mine). My head type, which I also lead with, is 5. My gut type is 9. My heart type is 4. Rebma appears to lead with a heart type: 2. If I had to guess, she might also use 7 and 1, making her tritype 271

WINGS
The characteristics of a type can vary and they often take on traits of one of the neighboring types, called a wing. For example, my middle number 9 is actually a 9w1. This means that, while I display many of the characteristics of a 9, I also display some characters of a 1 through the lens of 9, moreso than 8. Thus I have 9 with a 1 wing. It's sometimes difficult to distinguish which one is the base and which one is the wing (ex: I had a hard time deciding between 1w9 and 9w1) if they're both within the same type (9 and 1 are both gut types).
Me; 5 balanced (I don't know the shorthand notation for this), 9w1, 4w5

INSTINCTUAL VARIANT
sp - self-preservation, the concern of one's own safety, usually stereotyped to be the most reclusive of the three
sx - sexual, a focus on interpersonal relationships, usually stereotyped to be the most intense of the three
so - social, a focus on standings within larger societal groups


-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Some sources.
Enneagram Institute - Learning the Enneagram
Free Enneagram Tests
FunkyMBTIFiction's Introduction to MBTI Cognitive Functions, contains helpful links
MBTI-Notes Tumblr blog, has good resources

Ahhh I should have been more specific but I was half asleep. It was the enneagram that I didn't understand and couldn't figure out where your extra numbers came from not the MBTI sorry!! But that explanation probably would help a lot of people to understand it better regardless. (Did I mention how slightly unnerving it is to see my thought processes pasted here for everyone to peruse?lol)

Thanks for the resources I'll look into it all.
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Rebma » Sat May 28, 2016 12:00 am

Double posting to add the characters typing I did.

ESTJ-A

ISTP-T

INFP-T

ENFJ-A

these were Hella accurate.
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Re: Characters and Personality Typing

Postby Mafia Salad » Sat May 28, 2016 2:29 am

I had a different one of the Hippocratic four temperments in mind for each of my first four characters. They all developed beyond the simplicity of that with life experience but it made for a unique playing experience for each character right from the get go.
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