Subduing characters

[Rusalka]

Another thought I have: Maybe we could make a system that allows people to hit somebody in a head with a bone club, and then he is in coma for 2d6 days or something like that? Could be quite useful improvement in fighting system.

[EchoMan]

(Split from another suggestion. Posts in the suggestion forum should discuss the current suggestion. New suggestions - new threads)

[Rusalka]

Ok, as this recived a new suggestion status I have to add:

Every weapon, would have it's damage, and stun value. Stun bar could be also used later for diseases.

Stunned person would turn into an object, just like a dead body, but without droping things, and it will wake up after some time (few hours/days). The difference between the dead body and a stunned one, would be visible only after examination.

Place for big discussion: Can stunned character be killed?

If not, it would allow battles where a lot of people are defeated and still alive - taken into captivity or left there alone.

If yes, I would make every character whatever the damage is, stop on 0% health where he/she becomes always stunned, and then he/she has to be stabbed one more time to be dead. Chars with higher health would need to be hit on normal basis (and then one more time after reaching 0 %)

One more thing: 0% health means that char will die in a day.

[Piscator]

In the German forum the suggestion came up to not let characters die automatically when their hit points drop to zero, but also make it necessary to land a killing blow to finish them off. Equipment would be dropped in the usual manner, so people could still rob each other, but they wouldn't need to kill to do that (although they could if they wanted to).

My problem with a stun property of weapons is its randomness. It's always bad style to let events of vital importance be decided by the roll of a single die. It would just be annoying to be told by the game that you can't play your character for a week with no better explanation than "well, tough luck".

[Chris]

I think that dropping possessions when unconscious is important. That is a major reason people kill. If you can't get the stuff you want, you won't stop at knocking someone out. If he/she does drop everything, then taking him/her prisoner becomes easier without the prisoner having weapon, shield, and crowbar.

[Rusalka]

I think it would be better even for dead chars to keep their inventory with them - everyone could pick it up, just as it happens with clothes. And body shouldn't disapear until the burial is finished! The same mechanic should be applied for stunned chars, just without a bury button

My problem with a stun property of weapons is its randomness.

That is a matter of proper balancing. I think difficulty of stun shouldn't be much lower then kill. But there would be a big chance that you will get stunned before the fatal blow.

Idea how to code that: Weapons in general should have higher stun then damage values. The difference is that stun falls down every hour, and damage not. So if somebody will be assaulted by few attackers at the same time, he will be stunned for sure, cause he won't get the chance to clear his stun bar (and probably save his life).

t would just be annoying to be told by the game that you can't play your character for a week with no better explanation than "well, tough luck".

Well, that sounds like a better alternative than a simple "game over" And I don't like the idea of beeing out for 7 days 2-3 on maximum is enough.

[SekoETC]

Taking stuff from stunned people could be like pickpocketing in other games, each attempt would have a chance of alerting the person. Small items would reduce the bar less than big items, but it could display a random selection of items with big ones being more likely to be visible. Thus things like keys might take several searches to find, making it more likely for the person to wake up.

[Doug R.]

In the German forum the suggestion came up to not let characters die automatically when their hit points drop to zero, but also make it necessary to land a killing blow to finish them off. Equipment would be dropped in the usual manner, so people could still rob each other, but they wouldn't need to kill to do that (although they could if they wanted to).

I support this version of the suggestion. However, it would need to be made clear, on the attack menu, that a character was incapacitated. In the heat of battle, one tends not to keep track of hit points, so it should be made dreadfully obvious if you're about to attack someone that you will most assuredly kill (i.e. incapacitated).

[Piscator]

I guess an incapacitated char could be displayed among the corpses with a "kill" instead of a "bury" button. Since I don't think that a "coup de grace" needs to be a regular attack, this should work quite well. If we also generate the appropriate events, it should be pretty clear what's going on.

Whether the stuff drops to the ground or whether it remains on the body, where it can be accessed by everyone, doesn't really matter. The latter option would keep the place tidy, but it would also require to have a mechanic to dig the body up again or at least a chance to veto a started burying project. Otherwise it would be too easy to effectively destroy anything a person is carrying around.

And I have to apologize for not reading thoroughly enough. I was still under the assumption that stunning should work like suggested in the original post. Gradual stunning would of course be completely acceptable. I'd still rather not introduce yet another bar and hijack either health (like in the suggestion above) or tiredness instead.

[Doug R.]

How do incapacitated character's heal if they drop everything? Do they need to be manually revived by another character, say to 1% health?

[Rusalka]

Yes, I believe so. Otherwise it will just die from wounds. Or we could even introduce some bandages etc. necessary for that. Then it would require a special project. Would make fights more interesting if sides were trying to take wounded somewhere safe and heal them, or not

[Snickie]

As far as bandages and such doing healing, isn't that what healing food is for? A bear attacks me for twenty-six damage, and I can eat some raisins or papayas or whatever and be back to full health again, no bandages necessary.

Unless, of course, by being incapacitated, you are unable to pick up anything such as healing food, or unable to eat it if you manage somehow not to drop it...?

[Rusalka]

Bandages are not for healing, never were. Bandages are there for keeping you alive, while your body heals itself, faster then you could bleed to death. That is the difference between normal Cantr healing, and bandages. And when char has 0% health it can't do anything. Somebody else has to put them on.

[Snickie]

So basically it would speed up the healing process, especially for characters who can't do anything themselves? If a character with 0% health is bandaged, and then somebody moves in for the kill, would the bandaged character die or live?

Yes, I know you said that bandages aren't for healing; I'm still trying to make sense of this.

[Piscator]

Well, I see two options. Either characters wake up by themselves after one or two days, with a monstrous headache and weak like a kitten, but otherwise capable of picking up their stuff and healing themselves or we make it so that incapacitated chars die if their wounds remain untreated.

I can see merit in both ideas, but at the moment I'd support the first one as it wouldn't require a mechanic to heal others and also would make perfect sense in association with natural healing, whose reintroduction has been in the accepted bin for quite a while now if I remember correctly.