Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

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reve
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby reve » Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:19 am

I aggree with CrashBlizz. I found myself in a similar situation: I had to many chars to look after them with equal attention. I've chosen some boring but longlasting tasks for those which I found less attractive to me in the momment. So it can be done without any interface or mechanics upgrade, you just simply have to want to do it.

On the other side I think we miss one thing: lockpicking is not breaking the lock with a crowbar... When someone (skilled) wants to pick the lock you have small chance to hear it, even if you are inside the room/building/vehicle. But in Cantr we break the locks with brute force. And it comes to 'how good Cantr should reflect reality?' question...


Imho if we want to make any kind of upgrade in discussed matter I would support SumBums idea with 50% chances of hearing in one of the inside rooms. But I still think it's unneeded, and do not agree with arguments promoting laziness - like with one man crews or players with too many chars.
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Cogliostro
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby Cogliostro » Mon Aug 02, 2010 8:39 pm

What do you say to people whose "laziness" is caused by having a life outside of checking Cantr?
I thought we loved those kinds of players. It even says in our frontpage "constitution" that Cantr's slow placed, you can check it as little or as much as you want and still be able to play your characters convincingly.

Well, if you have to pop onto your ship's deck every Cantrian tick, just to check if there's anyone breaking in yet, then I guess we're adamantly not giving anything to the casual players, and every advantage to the "hardworking" 13 year-old clickfester.
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby reve » Tue Aug 03, 2010 11:10 am

Cogliostro wrote:Well, if you have to pop onto your ship's deck every Cantrian tick, just to check if there's anyone breaking in yet, then I guess we're adamantly not giving anything to the casual players, and every advantage to the "hardworking" 13 year-old clickfester.


That's kind of argument that I fully understand. But breaking a lock takes 8 ticks, with 2 characters - 4 ticks. It's still 12 real hours. I assume that you can check your lock twice a real day?

I'm not talking about no-life people playing Cantr round the clock. I, myself, often forget to check some characters if there are no new events on the characters page. But I do am lazy as hell...
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby Doug R. » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:27 pm

Doug R. wrote:...I'd advocate for making docked characters (and characters inside vehicles on land) visible upon exiting a cabin/building. I think this is very reasonable and logical, applies more broadly...
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby SekoETC » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:42 pm

Yeah, that would make sense. I think I remember an incident of suddenly noticing there were people in a docked boat that had docked to my ship while I wasn't watching and I was like holy crap, how did they get here? Or maybe there was only one person, I can't even remember for sure which of my characters experienced this.
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby phoenixannwn » Wed Sep 01, 2010 1:30 am

I'm in favor of this, for buildings AND boats. Not because I don't want to go outside and check, but for compensation of realism.
Think about it like this: when someone breaks into your house and robs you, you're going to hear them rifling through things, or even walking around. You can also have open doors and see them. In Cantr, you can't have this. So maybe you should at least be able to hear them breaking in. Maybe your character's in a building (and I do agree only one room back--any farther than that, and even IRL you're probably not going to hear them) working on a project, or a note, or something involving (yes, sex too) and they don't want to leave the room. Maybe it's a barracks, and it's their room but the common room is still supposed to be locked. So they don't have a reason to be constantly checking the locks. It's simply OOC. In your house, right now, how often do you check the locks? Unless you have obsessive compulsive disorder or HAVE been broken into recently, I'm thinking at most, you check it before bed, sex, and when you get up and get home.
Bottom line, yes, it's game formula behavior, but it's not what your character would realistically do.
Boats are hazardous enough. Months spent out at sea, maybe lost, or running out of food. All your time needs to be spend conserving and doing practical things like building. Unless you're following the shore, there's no way to get help quick if you need it. And unless you've memorized the general timings of the ticks (the timing system still mystifies me, and if it weren't for CantrSpy I wouldn't even know how long the ticks were) you're not going take the chance of leaving only to have the tick turn over and you lose those hours of work. It's irritating.
In any case, 12 hours to pick a lock is nothing. Let's say I have to work two days in a row. I work 7 hours, come home exhausted, and fall right asleep. If I have to work the next day, I don't get to play Cantr at all that day because I get home at 1:00am at the earliest, sleep heavy and long till around 2 or 3 pm, then get up and go to work at 5. It takes me about an hour to get ready (4:00) and I have to walk (leave at 4:30) or bike (leave at 4:45) which only leaves me 30 to 45 minutes to socialize with my boyfriend.
And I am NOT a busy person. All I do is sleep and work and hang out around the house with my boyfriend.
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby Cogliostro » Mon Mar 26, 2012 4:15 pm

Today, years later, this feature is as necessary as it was back then. I have some new points to make now, though.

Firstly, our ship holds nowadays are capable of hosting a huge variety of machinery, all of which can create long projects, forcing people to be in the cabin instead of on the deck. Checking every 3 hours "is anyone breaking in or no?" is out of the question except for that rare percentage of masochist obsessive-compulsives we're lucky to have playing Cantr. For the rest of us, it's a totally unnecessary clickfest, is impractical, unrealistic, and we want it gone already.

Vehicles AND buildings should get this feature and notify all those inside all rooms about "a loud noise from the outside", without exactly specifying what it is. It could be knocking on the door, or it could be 5 crowbars slamming into your lock.

Secondly, to appease those who like to imagine Cantr buildings as dungeons or catacombs (nothing wrong with that idea by me), let's eventually make it so in the case of buildings, the notification only goes so deep- say 2 or 3 levels. Ships only have one level, but there's the situation when another ship is docked to it, and a third is docked to that and a fourth to that. Then someone on the last ship in that setup is effectively quite a few levels deep "in the catacombs".
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby SekoETC » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:11 pm

If you can afford all those machines, you can afford to hire a newspawn to stand guard on deck. Or better yet, hire a couple, they'll keep each other entertained. It would make sense if you could hear something from outside, but when that doesn't happen in general, why should it happen with ships or lockbreaking in particular? It's completely normal for people to come checking on stationary ships and breaking in if no one is on deck. It's more likely that the owner is dead than that they were working in a hold/cabin and someone else would steal the ship if respectable people didn't salvage it first.
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby Cogliostro » Mon Mar 26, 2012 5:14 pm

Seko, I'd like it to be that way too, but you and I know it just isn't. Nobody hires a newspawn to stand guard on their deck. Ever.

And besides, you could be a recluse in the midst of the sea, just by yourself working inside your holds on longterm projects. If someone were to attack your ship, you should be the first person to know that, so you can at least come on deck and meet your attackers.
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby Rebma » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:10 pm

I kinda like the idea of one room deep, but only because of the ability we have already to hear "someone trying to attract attention" Or whatever that notification is that you get when you're out milling past a boat and someone in a cabin is knocking.
If you can hear a knock from a cabin while outside a ship, you should be able to hear a noise like a crowbar outside the ship while in a cabin. That's my only reason for supporting this.
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Re: Breaking ship locks - fair warning.

Postby Oasis » Thu Apr 05, 2012 4:55 pm

Cantr isn't real life, that argument does not fly here.

I agree with notification on knocking or lock breaking one room deep on buildings and ships.

We often have no choice on ships to be inside, and in a building, often an inner room is the bedroom, or kitchen, and there is rp going on, you can't always check to see if someone has sent in a note to you, nor would ever be able to check if someone has knocked for you as it leaves no lasting message. This is often a big problem for my leader characters who are often needed when they've gone inside.

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